MediaWiki talk:Wikibase-SortedProperties

On this page, old discussions are archived after 180 days. An overview of all archives can be found at this page's archive index. The current archive is located at Archive 3.

SpBot archives all sections tagged with {{Section resolved|1=~~~~}} after 3 days.

Production/publication/premiere sorting

It is requested that an edit or modification be made to this protected page.

The page has been added to Category:Wikidata protected edit requests.

Administrators: Please apply <nowiki> or {{Tl}} to the tag after the request is fulfilled.

Fulfill this request after you checked that it does not contain evil code

A few things that I think make sense to group into blocks and list in chronological order:

P2754 (production date)
...
P577 (publication date)
P291 (place of publication)
P123 (publisher)
...
P4634 (premiere type)
P1191 (date of first performance)
P4647 (location of first performance)
...
P10855 (opus number)
P528 (catalog code)

1. Production date should be listed prior to publication.
2. Publication properties should be grouped in one block.
3. Same for premiere/first performance.
4. Opus number should be moved right before catalog code. Solidest (talk) 07:38, 27 January 2023 (UTC)

Create a new section start and end events

It is requested that an edit or modification be made to this protected page.

The page has been added to Category:Wikidata protected edit requests.

Administrators: Please apply <nowiki> or {{Tl}} to the tag after the request is fulfilled.

Fulfill this request after you checked that it does not contain evil code

Copy from above:

"inception" seems misplaced inside Classification, e.g. date of birth is further down, after names and titles. How about two new sections "start dates and events" and "end dates and events"? GeoGQL (talk) 02:26, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

Those two new sections would fix my concerns. I'd also add "separated from" and "merged into" to those groups. I assume the new sections would go near the top, because they have diverse useage (similar to the "names" section). Arctic.gnome (talk) 14:57, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

---

Create a section dates and events new sections dates and events and inside that create two subsections containing the listed properties - more can be added later.

1. section start dates and events
   1. inception (P571)
2. section end dates and events
   1. dissolved, abolished or demolished date (P576)

GeoGQL (talk) 16:25, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

I think "start dates" should include inception (P571), replaces (P1365), and separated from (P807). "End dates" should include dissolved, abolished or demolished date (P576), replaced by (P1366), and merged into (P7888). Both should be near the top, either before or after the "name" section. --Arctic.gnome (talk) 16:45, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

Sorry, I forgot the placement. Support for directly after "Names and titles". GeoGQL (talk) 16:49, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

Regarding the other properties: Does it always imply that the subject started/ended? For merged into it probably means end. But replaces means that the role of something else changed, not the existence of the subject nor the necessarily the object. But I don't like to spend much time on that now, before the proposed sections are added to the page. GeoGQL (talk) 16:58, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

@Arctic.gnome: I removed the mention of dates, since beside dates also locations could be added to the start/end event. A journey may have these. GeoGQL (talk) 17:43, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

More to consider:

1. period/point
   1. P2348 (time period) - section Events
   2. P585 (point in time) - section Works of art
2. start
   1. P619 (UTC date of spacecraft launch) - section Events/Space flights
   2. P580 (start time) - section Works of art
   3. P2754 (production date) - section Works of art
   4. P1619 (date of official opening) - section Constructions
3. end
   1. P620 (UTC date of spacecraft landing) - section Events/Space flights
   2. P582 (end time) - section Works of art
   3. P3999 (date of official closure) - section Constructions

GeoGQL (talk) 17:38, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

My considerations:

• P2348 (time period) usually links to a historical era associated with the subject. Its usage is often more subjective than "inception". I think it can stay with events.
• P585 (point in time) is used similarly to "start time" but for instantanious events. It has much more general use than just for art. I'd say put it with start events.
• P619 and P620 (spacecrafts) are specific events on a timeline, so I don't think they are about "starting" and "ending" in the same way.
• P580 and P582 (start and end times) are used much more broadly than just for works of art, I see every kind of entity linking to it. This should be moved.
• P2754 (production date) is more related to "publication date" and "public domain date", so I think those three should stay together.
• P1619 and P3999 (opening and closing) are specific to constructions and can stay there.
• I also noticed that P729 (service entry), P730 (service retirement), P2669 (discontinued date) are under the section "Constructions", but are more broadly used. We don't have a section for "products and services", so instead maybe those three should go under "Non-person entities", maybe as their own subsection? I'd do the same to P6949 (announcement date), P5204 (date of commercialization), and P5017 (last update).
• Mayeb also put P10786 (date of incorporation) with start events.

In summary, that would give us this after the "Names" section:

1. Starting and ending
   1. Start events
      1. P571 (inception)
      2. P10786 (date of incorporation)
      3. P580 (start time)
      4. P585 (point in time)
      5. P1365 (replaces)
      6. P807 (separated from)
      7. P155 (follows)
   2. End events
      1. P576 (dissolved, abolished or demolished date)
      2. P582 (end time)
      3. P1366 (replaced by)
      4. P7888 (merged into)
      5. P156 (followed by)

and would give us this under "Non-person entities"

1. Product and service dates
   1. P6949 (announcement date)
   2. P729 (service entry)
   3. P5204 (date of commercialization)
   4. P730 (service retirement)
   5. P5017 (last update)
   6. P2669 (discontinued date).

Arctic.gnome (talk) 18:47, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Sort all variants of images just under image (P18) / Image

With many of these properties https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P18#P1659, I think most of them could directly go just under image (P18) Bouzinac ^{💬●✒️●💛} 13:06, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

What do you mean by "variants of images"? Do you mean all properties of datatype "Commons media file" that store images? CV213 (talk) 14:44, 7 February 2024 (UTC)

Ticket for alphabetical ordering of external IDs

For anyone interested, I've made a ticket asking for external IDs to be ordered alphabetically by default: phab:T340659 - Nikki (talk) 14:53, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

One could also simply split the page into two pages 1) Statements and 2) Identifiers - names of the proposed pages taken from the names of sections in the item-namespace pages. CV213 (talk) 13:37, 8 February 2024 (UTC)

Rename VIAF-related IDs to VIAF cluster ID and VIAF source IDs

Current name too vague.

@Epìdosis: CV213 (talk) 13:46, 23 February 2024 (UTC)

Personally I don't agree, I think the present name is clear enough. Epìdosis 15:32, 23 February 2024 (UTC)

Related can be anything. The type of relation isn't stated. "human eye" isn't stated as "human"-related in Wikidata. VIAF-related IDs encompasses more than what is actually contained in the section. CV213 (talk) 15:47, 23 February 2024 (UTC)

Sorting statements in references

Tracked in Phabricator
Task T169960

I think that this feature should be extended to statements in references. Title, publication date, stated in, retrieved url, language, etc, should be sorted in a well defined way and not randomly as user added them. Thanks. Emijrp (talk) 17:10, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

@Emijrp: I very much agree, it is a known software issue; I have created phab:T321952 for this issue in 2022, which I then merged with the older (2017) phab:T169960, concerning also qualifiers. All this is still completely stuck, unfortunately ... --Epìdosis 20:54, 13 March 2024 (UTC)