Property talk:P1695

Active discussions


NLP ID (unique)
former National Library of Poland unique identifier. Format: "A", 7 digits, "X" or another digit. For the newer 16-digit format, use "NLP ID (PLWABN record)" (P7293)
[create Create a translatable help page (preferably in English) for this property to be included here]
Format “A[0-9]{7}[0-9X]: value must be formatted using this pattern (PCRE syntax). (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Known exceptions: Władysław Szafer Institute of Botany (Q8041247)
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1695#Format, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)
Conflicts with “instance of (P31): Wikimedia disambiguation page (Q4167410), Wikimedia category (Q4167836): this property must not be used with the listed properties and values. (Help)
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1695#Conflicts with P31, hourly updated report, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)
Single value: this property generally contains a single value. (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist.
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1695#Single value, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)
Distinct values: this property likely contains a value that is different from all other items. (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist.
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1695#Unique value, SPARQL (every item), SPARQL (by value), SPARQL (new)
Allowed entity types are Wikibase item (Q29934200): the property may only be used on a certain entity type (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist.
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P1695#allowed entity types, SPARQL (new)

Fixing the link to the NLP itemsEdit

The previous default link (not PLWABN) should be changed to the shape like here: →Polish Wikipedia ("..id"..idIM=04&NU=01IM=05&TX=&NU=01). That was changed by our interface-admin Paweł Ziemian about 2 months ago and all of the items are display correctly (in that time I was checked more than one hundred links to the Polish National Library – every single item is displaying properly). Please change it to the previous shape, because now the Wikidata instructions require (every single time) to put digits starting with "9810". Probably every article in Polish Wikipedia links to the previous set of signs (starting with letter "A") – at least I had never seen (for a couple of years) in Polish Wikipedia linking with items in PLWABN standard. It was my intention to direct this request with this bug earlier (wrong linking), but I didn't manage to do so. Hope somebody fix it. Regards. --Pit rock (talk) 01:44, 24 July 2019 (UTC)

@Pit rock: I know it sucks, but it's necessary for a couple of reasons. Most importantly because "old" IDs—A12345678—aren't displayed anywhere in the authority records themselves, whereas "new" IDs—9810123456789012—are. Secondly, because all NLP IDs have updated been throughout VIAF as well. Jay D. Easy (talk) 20:38, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
@Jay D. Easy: I've taken note of the fact that VIAF updated all of the NLP IDs. So, now I'm putting (Wikidata identifiers) these "new" IDs with "9810" prefix. Thanks to Paweł Ziemian that's no problem technically (now both IDs are displaying properly in Polish Wikipedia). I know that this dual ID display is temporarily, but we'll (Polish Wikipedians) have to update NLP IDs on Wikidata. That will be time-consuming, but if PLWABN is the target solution we are responsible for undertaking it. So my request to withdraw these changes (original NLP IDs → PLWABN IDs) is now obsolete. Thank you for your time. Regards.   Done --Pit rock (talk) 21:16, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
@Pit rock: good looking out, mate. I've been updating IDs left and right as well, but we have quite a ways to go. Jay D. Easy (talk) 21:30, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
  • If the id changes, a new property should be used. Currently values should not be replaced with new values from a different system. Please formulate a proposal at Wikidata:Property proposal. --- Jura 21:33, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
@Jura1: why? I can't find any info on this procedure. Point me in the right direction? Jay D. Easy (talk) 22:06, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
This property was proposed and defined at Wikidata:Property_proposal/Archive/28#P1695. I'm not aware of any procedure of making Wikidata values unstable. Where did you get the idea that you could change the values to another system or delete valid statements? --- Jura 22:08, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
@Jura1: I am honestly inquiring as to why it would be more feasible to go through the process of property proposal again when the resultant property will end up linking to the exact same set of authority records. What makes a property "unstable?" Wouldn't it be easier to change the property constraint back to its new form, assuming users will be more inclined to fix property constraint violations rather than build up a new property? Jay D. Easy (talk) 22:21, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
Data users who relied on P1695 for this data would suddenly get something else. If they used Wikidata to map their data to qids this would suddenly fail. The proposal process is fairly straightforward. It should take a week or so. With a new property, users can explicitly select what they get. --- Jura 11:18, 8 August 2019 (UTC)
@Jura1: I've noticed that the numeric/character string has been changed to the original form: starting with "A" instead of "9810". If you are going to maintain that NLP ID standard please change the URL format:$1$1. As you will see that "old" URL will always generate wrong authority data: now that will be "Biuro Usług Promocyjnych (Sopot)" (another time it will be somthing else, but "destination" will always be wrong; for someone else – from different IP or rather user's uncleared cache – could load another set of data). In Polish Wikipedia we have already fixed that URL format. I'll be grateful for the changes. --Pit rock (talk) 19:56, 8 August 2019 (UTC)
If the formatter URL doesn't work anymore, it needs to be de-activated:   Done --- Jura 11:18, 11 August 2019 (UTC)
Note, both ID formats now work through the wikidata-externalid-url service. The format constraint needs to be updated and it would probably good to add some additional examples with the 'A' format. ArthurPSmith (talk) 14:10, 14 August 2019 (UTC)
  • Thanks for setting this up. I added it as formatter url. However, I don't see how we could use two different schemes with the same property. As outlined above, the way to go would be to create a new property and populate that with the new values. Changing random values of this property to some other scheme isn't really helping keeping this a stable identifier. If NLP is found to be unstable, maybe we should stop including it entirely. --- Jura 15:09, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
  • It breaks Wikidata's stability if we keep changing around identifiers. If users want to support a new identifier, use a new property. If there was interest in it, it would already have it set up by now. --- Jura 14:51, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
  • PS: In the meantime, PLWABN ID (P7293) was created. See its proposal for the difference between the two identifiers. --- Jura 09:32, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
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