Property talk:P5230

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chromosome count
karyological information on the number of chromosomes typical for a species

Represents	chromosome number (Q54031484)
Data type	Quantity
Allowed values	1 ≤ 𝓧 ≤ not applicable
Example	Homo sapiens (Q15978631) → 46 Passiflora pentagona (Q17557987) → 24
See also	ploidy (P1349)
Lists	Items with the most statements of this property Count of items by number of statements (chart) Items with the most statements Items with the fewest statements Count of items by number of sitelinks (chart) Items with the most sitelinks Items with the most sitelinks, but no link to one Wikipedia (sample: Welsh Wikipedia, cywiki) Items with the fewest sitelinks Most linked wikis Items with the most identifier properties Items with no other statements Most recently created items Items with novalue claims Items with unknown value claims Usage history (total) Usage history (main statement) Minimum and maximum Items with highest numeric value Items with lowest numeric value Database reports/Constraint violations/P5230 Map Random list
Proposal discussion	Proposal discussion
Current uses	Total 77 Main statement 75 97.4% of uses Qualifier 2 2.6% of uses

Explanations [Edit]

Typical value for this property is the most frequent chromosome count in typical body cell in normal adult individual of a species. For example at Homo sapiens (Q15978631):

chromosome count	46 edit 0 references add reference
		add value

As exceptional cases, there are some types of variation in chromosome count. Here are instructions for that.

• 1. Sexual difference. Some species have different chromosome count between male and female. This happens in certain sex-determination system, for example haplodiploidy or X0 sex-determination system. In such case, use applies to part (P518) with male organism (Q44148) or female organism (Q43445), like Jack jumper ant#P5230.

chromosome count	1 edit applies to part male organism 0 references add reference 2 edit applies to part female organism 0 references add reference
		add value

• 2. Life cycle difference. There are species which have different characteristic "generations" having different chromosome count through biological life cycle. This process is known as alternation of generations. In such case, use applies to part (P518) with, for example, gametophyte (Q189951) or sporophyte (Q647173), like [put example species here].

chromosome count	10? (we need example) edit applies to part gametophyte 0 references add reference 20? (we need example) edit applies to part sporophyte 0 references add reference
		add value

• 3. Cell type difference. There are different chromosome count between cell type (Q189118). For example, red blood cell (Q37187) has 0 chromosome. cancer cell (Q4118072) has various number. For this property, use chromosome count for typical body cell (e.g. In human, use 46)
• 4. Variations in disease or syndrome. For example, Down syndrome (Q47715) has 47 chromosomes. This kind of data is stored at disease or syndrome item page like Down syndrome#P5230, but not species page. Because there are many kind of disease or syndrome which has chromosome count variation.

Integer: values should be integers (ie. they shouldn't have a fractional part) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P5230#integer, SPARQL

Range from “1” to “+∞”: values should be in the range from “1” to “+∞”. (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P5230#Range

Allowed entity types are: the property may only be used on a certain entity type (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P5230#Entity types

Scope is: the property must be used by specified way only (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P5230#Scope, SPARQL

Monoploid number

Tobias1984 (talk) Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; * *Andy's edits TypingAway (talk) Daniel Mietchen (talk) Tinm (talk) Tubezlob Vincnet41 Netha Hussain Fractaler Tris T7 ^{TT me} Photocyte GoEThe (talk) Egon Willighagen

Notified participants of WikiProject Biology @Ptolusque, Pintoch: This property is well intended but we have to really be careful about the definition. The definition should be "number of chromosomes in 1 chromosomal set", i.e. monoploid number. The example given on property page (human: P5230 = 46) illustrates the problem. Humans have 23 chromosomes in one set. 46 is the number in most somatic cells. But some cells in human body are tetraploid (92) or more. IMHO this should be fixed before the erroneous usage spreads.--Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 08:43, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

@Brya: Please comment because you starting using this property already. Thanks --Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 12:19, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

Hello @Vojtěch Dostál: Sperm and egg are haploid (n = 23). Body cell is diploid (2n = 46). Cancer cell? can be tetraploid or more (4n= 92 or more). I think count for typical body cell (2n = 46) is good for this property like w:en:List of organisms by chromosome count. Is there problem about using this number? --Was a bee (talk) 15:07, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

I had actually given some thought to this. By itself chromosome count is always incomplete; it also needs ploidy. A common way of notation is "2n = 46". Wikidata could do it both ways 1) "n=23" (not "monoploid", but "haploid") and "ploidy = diploidy" or 2) "total number=46" and "ploidy = diploidy": the rest can be calculated. However, total number of chromosomes has the advantage that it should always be possible to count number of chromosomes, but not always possible to establish level of ploidy. Total number is safer. - Brya (talk) 16:32, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

There is a huge problem with defining a "typical body cell". Some organisms are haploid at one cell stage and diploid at another. I'd really go for "monoploid number" here. Or we need to use some mandatory qualifiers, eg. ploidy (P1349) as a qualifier of chromosome count (P5230), or we're going to get crazy soon. --Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 16:36, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

AFAIK, all organisms have half the full complement of chromosomes at one cell stage and the full complement of chromosomes at another. Use of ploidy as a qualifier should be restricted to qualify the full number. - Brya (talk) 02:59, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

I think the variation of the chromosome count in one biological species can be divided roughly into 4 types. Let me list up here:

• 1. Y Male-female difference. I think it is OK to use applies to part (P518) for this type of variations, like Jack jumper ant (Q138636).
• 2. Life cycle stage difference like w:en:gametophyte. Current main discussion target? I think it is good to use qualifier to specify the stage. Any ideas?
• 3. Cell type variations. Red blood cell has 0 chromosome in it. Cancer cell has various number. I think it is OK to store only number for typical body cell. Or any other ideas?
• 4. Y Disease kind variations. For instance, Down syndrome has 47 chromosomes. I think this is not controversial point. I think it is better to be included this type of data at disease item page (e.g. Down syndrome (Q47715)), not at species item page (e.g. Homo sapiens (Q15978631)).

--Was a bee (talk) 06:16, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

I added instruction text about variations (see above). I'm happy if there is example of variance of biological life cycle (Q513359). --Was a bee (talk) 04:20, 17 June 2018 (UTC)