User talk:Innocent bystander/Archive 7

Add topic
Active discussions

HøgnorskEdit

Hi Innocent bystander, looking at some of the items for these pagesat nowiki, I was wondering why they didn't have a label in Høgnorsk. Apparently, we don't have a code for that yet. Is there one that could apply per Help:Monolingual text languages? If yes, I think we should request it.
--- Jura 15:51, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

Good idea, but I am not an expert, neither in Högnorsk or language-codes. -- Innocent bystander (talk) 18:13, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
  • From [1], I take it the code would be "nn-hognorsk". Would you have one or two good samples that could be used for the request?
    --- Jura 08:16, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
    From nn:Spesial:Prefiksindeks/Hn/?! -- Innocent bystander (talk) 10:03, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
    Not necessarily. Initially it might only work for monolingual strings anyways. Q3352677#P1705 could do. Is it correct?
    --- Jura 11:03, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
    Well, I do not know if/how a monolingual datatype could be used here. I have avoided it in Sami and East Swedish names since I do not have good sources. Are there any Högnorsk sources telling that this is the Högnorsk name of this place? @Jon Harald Søby: -- Innocent bystander (talk) 11:11, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
    nn:Hn/Øyi Bømlo ?
    --- Jura 11:13, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
That just means "the island of Bømlo". The Nynorsk Wikipedia has weird naming conventions for disambiguations where they instead of "Georgia (delstat)" use "Delstaten Georgia" as the article name. That is the case here as well, to separate the island from the municipality. Jon Harald Søby (talk) 11:48, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
Would you have 2 or 3 samples, we could use?
--- Jura 13:37, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
Høgnorsk is not really used by anyone, as can be witnessed by the number of pages written in it in the Nynorsk wikipedia, and adding a language code for it would not get approved because it doesn't have an ISO 639-3 code (and probably never will, because it is a variant of Nynorsk). Jon Harald Søby (talk) 11:48, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
  • If you find a way to eliminate these pages, it would simplify things. In the meantime, we need a proper way to identify them. Applicable standard isn't the one you mention (see Help abvove).
  • When I asked for a code to make it possible to add labels in Eastern Swedish (sv-fi) I was asked to give some examples where it could be added in a monolingual datatype property. But I cannot find where it could be useful there. But it could be useful to add a sv-fi label into many items, where it differ from sv-se. One example: submachine gun (Q178550). Eastern Swedish here says maskinpistol while sv-se says kulsprutepistol. -- Innocent bystander (talk) 18:01, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
@Innocent bystander: I can't think of a single example where it wouldn't suffice to add the Finland-Swedish term as an alias. The same would go for Høgnorsk. 01:14, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
But as like one of the Sweden-Swedish words often better fits as a label than the others, the same thing could be said about one specific Finland-Swedish word. Even East-Swedish have dialects, and not all of them would be a good fit as a sv-fi label. Estonian and Ukranian Swedish are harder to find a good label for since they do not have a standardised vocabulary. -- Innocent bystander (talk) 04:38, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
  • Aliases are generally pretty useless when it comes to determine what they contain. They are needed to make some properties searchable, e.g. monolingual string properties. Every time the label in one language is different from others, it is useful. For such reasons we have en-gb, en-ca etc.
    --- Jura 07:55, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
  • The aliases in Swedish were destroyed in the early days of Wikidata, when the titles of redirects on svwiki were used to add aliases. Often very distant related articles have been redirected. And sometimes even dysphemism (Q844782) of people have been redirected, rather than again and again delete them. -- Innocent bystander (talk) 08:00, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
  • Maybe it's worth cleaning them up. The other day I did units of measure (e.g. [2]) and that what messy despite other people having already done some cleaning [3].
    --- Jura 08:05, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
  • It definitely would. But I do not have the time. I am ~120 years late with adding numbers from statistics reports. -- Innocent bystander (talk) 08:29, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
I tried to do a query to find some: looks like something to do in 150 years ;) .. Anyways, back to the initial point: I made https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T148887
--- Jura 09:37, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
Sidenote regarding the behavior of Nynorsk Wikipedia.
@Jon Harald Søby: Jag ställde en frågan på WD:Diskusjon för ett tag sedan. Ska jag tolka ditt svar ovan som att "X i Uppland"´i artikelrubriken kan få "X" som label på nynorsk? -- Innocent bystander (talk) 18:01, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
@Innocent bystander: Ja. Jon Harald Søby (talk) 01:14, 22 October 2016 (UTC)
Takk! -- Innocent bystander (talk) 04:38, 22 October 2016 (UTC)

ModuleEdit

Hi, Innocent bystander. I brought a copy of the module into Incubator, where I'm now an admin. I'm trying to see if I can get it to work there, because then people building test wikis can have links into other Wikipedias. It would be purely one way, because you can't enter Incubator pages in Wikidata. But manual iw links do work in Incubator, so in principle maybe we could get it to work. Are you game to help me try? No rush, certainly. StevenJ81 (talk) 23:35, 22 December 2016 (UTC)

@StevenJ81: So Incubator has arbitrary access? That was new! -- Innocent bystander (talk) 06:13, 23 December 2016 (UTC)
I don't know if it does. Maybe that's why I couldn't get it to work. But I wasn't mostly going to rely on that; I assume that use of the qid parameter would be mandatory there. StevenJ81 (talk) 13:56, 23 December 2016 (UTC)
I tested to modify the module to see what the messages looked like. It does not look like there is any support to Wikibase, and therefor no access to Wikidata, even with qids on Incubator. Already the mw.wikibase-functions in LUA are refused, and that is a bad sign. But I know you can access the Wikidata api by the help of java. But that is far far above my knowledge. -- Innocent bystander (talk) 14:38, 23 December 2016 (UTC)
Mine, too. As I wrote over there, I'm asking someone if this type of request is timely or not. I'll let you know if we are looking to push things ahead any further. Meantime, Happy New Year! StevenJ81 (talk) 16:19, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

GeonamesEdit

Hi! First of all - Happy New Year! About geonames and that old BOTREQ, that I haven't touched for "some" time... Maybe you know some svwiki guy (or girl), who could run a dump analysis and scrape |geonames= from Geobox template? And maybe some other useful params, like country or type (for instance of (P31))? If I would have the data in one table, then I could fill up WD more quickly (with QS after data processing). All you need to do is to get initial 'yes' and then I could have further talk (technical detasils etc.). --Edgars2007 (talk) 08:46, 31 December 2016 (UTC)

Well, we had som different opinions about the GeoNames project several months ago, resulting in that I stopped editing in those articles and items. Some weeks ago, also Lsj gave up and left the project. I am not aware of many svwiki users with plenty of time and having the computer skills to analyse a dump. Fluff definitely know how to analyse a dump. And that is maybe the only (active) svwiki-user I know about. sv:Kategori:Wikipedia:Artiklar med geonames-parameter utan P1566 på Wikidata is a category filled with geonames-parameter that has no P1566 here. And adding P31 and P17 is probably better done from a GeoNames dump than a Wikipedia dump. It is closer to the source. Isn't it possible to "harvest" the Geobox? -- Innocent bystander (talk) 09:12, 31 December 2016 (UTC)
A bit embarassing perhaps, but I have very little (technical) knowledge of the WikiData project. The other stuff, like scrape articles and/or database dumps I'll happily help out with. Just let me know what you need, a CSV of article;geonameid;country;type? /Fluff (talk) 16:34, 31 December 2016 (UTC)
Tried to use "Harvest template" here to fill these items. But "constraints violations type undefined" stops me! Strange, you then have to add P31 first, and thereafter fill with P1566. That is a strange way to go! P1566 is a good source for P31, but you cannot add it! -- Innocent bystander (talk) 17:49, 31 December 2016 (UTC)
Things are going (see Fluff's svwiki talk page)... QS theoretically should be faster than HT. --Edgars2007 (talk) 15:17, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
Return to the user page of "Innocent bystander/Archive 7".