Wikidata:Property proposal/Person

Property proposal: Generic Authority control Person Organization
Creative work Place Sports Sister projects
Transportation Natural science Lexeme

See alsoEdit

This page is for the proposal of new properties.

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  3. See property creation policy.

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PersonEdit

sexEdit

   Under discussion
DescriptionBiological sex of an animal or person
Representssex (Q290)
Data typeItem
Domainhuman (Q5) or animal (Q729)
Allowed valuesmale (Q6581097), female (Q6581072), intersex (Q1097630), male organism (Q44148), female organism (Q43445)
Example 1Kitty Anderson (Q59160028)intersex (Q1097630)
Example 2Dolly (Q171433)female organism (Q43445)
Example 3AlexGray Parrot, Mitchell Park Zoo, Durban, July 2013.jpg (Q24628)male organism (Q44148)
Planned useThis property would be used for all individual animals with a known sex and for individual humans when their sex is notable (see Motivation below). Note that the existing sex or gender (P21) is being changed to just "gender" per consensus.
Robot and gadget jobsa bot will be written to migrate male organism (Q44148) and female organism (Q43445) claims from sex or gender (P21).
See alsosex or gender (P21) (which is being changed to just "gender"), property that may violate privacy (Q44601380)

MotivationEdit

After many years of debate and discussion, consensus was reached to split sex or gender (P21) into two separate properties. sex or gender (P21) will be renamed "gender" and a new "sex" property will be created to handle animal sex and the rare cases where a human's sex is notable separately from their gender. For example, Kitty Anderson (Q59160028) is a notable intersex (Q1097630) activist, but her gender is female (Q6581072). Previously, sex or gender (P21) had to be overloaded for both uses. In some previous discussions, concerns were raised about whether or not certain languages (especially Japanese and Chinese) had separate words for "sex" and "gender". It has been confirmed that both of those languages have separate words for the two concepts, and even if a language doesn't have separate words, they can still be disambiguated by the description. Kaldari (talk) 18:49, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  • A discussion from 2013 closed in 2019? I wonder if any of the participant are still active in Wikidata .. --- Jura 19:13, 6 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose use sex or gender (P21) with qualifiers. --- Jura 19:13, 6 December 2019 (UTC)
  • Actually, there are some benefits to split this unrelated to the explanation given above. --- Jura 01:07, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Weak oppose. On one hand it always made intuitive sense to me to split it for the sake of modularity and precision. On the other hand, it may become a "fun" battleground for people who will insist on setting the sex value of transgender people to what they were assigned at birth, and I'm not quite sure it's totally good. It may work well if a very clear and strongly enforced policy is defined for dealing with such cases in a way that presents precise information and is respectful to the subjects of the items. I'm not sure what this policy should actually be, though. I haven't seen a description of such a policy in the current proposals and discussions, but maybe I haven't searched well. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 20:55, 6 December 2019 (UTC)
    I think there should be a policy, that it should only be added to a person if and only if they have stated it themself publicly and unambiguously, otherwise we should only indicate gender. Robin van der Vliet (talk) (contribs) 15:23, 7 December 2019 (UTC)
    Yeah, that could be a possibility. As I said, the distinction generally makes sense, and I'll be happy to support it if there's a policy that will prevent the misuse of this property in unhelpful and transphobic ways. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 20:16, 7 December 2019 (UTC)
  • In my opinion we may keep current P21 for "(biological) sex" and create a new property "gender identity".--GZWDer (talk) 07:56, 7 December 2019 (UTC)
    • I think it makes more sense to do it the other way around, as the currently existing property is mostly used for persons to indicate their gender. Very few uses are for non-human animals in comparison to humans. Robin van der Vliet (talk) (contribs) 15:23, 7 December 2019 (UTC)
      • Agree with Robin, the current uses of P21 are mostly to indicate people's gender, so it would make the most sense to leave that one as the gender property. Kaldari (talk) 22:39, 7 December 2019 (UTC)
        Fully agree, P21 must be gender and not sex. --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 00:55, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Weak support I think it makes sense to seperate gender from sex, but there should be a proper policy to avoid harassment of trans people. Robin van der Vliet (talk) (contribs) 15:23, 7 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Support This distinction is needed. Amir (talk) 19:01, 7 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Support subject to the policy statements related on privacy of individuals stated in Wikidata:Living people. John Samuel (talk) 18:16, 8 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose. I oppose if the proposal means that a human's sex will be classified as "gender." "Sex" and "gender" are sometimes distinguished for valid reasons, and I don't think distinguishing them should only apply to "to handl[ing] animal sex and the rare cases where a human's sex is notable separately from their gender." Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 22:16, 8 December 2019 (UTC)
    A human's gender will be classified as "gender". A human's sex will be classified as "sex", but if and only if it's publicly known and relevant, and in compliance with Wikidata:Living people. Robin van der Vliet (talk) (contribs) 00:14, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    Kind of, but what concerns me is how do you define "relevant" in a way that won't be abused. The current situation at Sam Bettens (Q274154), for example, doesn't look optimal. It currently says:
    sex or gender:
    1. female / end time: 18 May 2019
    2. transgender male / start time: 18 May 2019; nature of statement: coming out
    I'm not transgender, so please do tell me if I'm saying something wrong and dumb, but from what I heard, transgender people usually feel that they've always been their gender, so saying that Sam Bettens was female until 18 May 2019 is probably not entirely correct.
    Should this be changed? Probably. Saying that he is male is probably correct, and saying that he's transgender is probably correct and relevant, too. Mentioning the coming out date is probably relevant, too.
    But here's the most important part for this discussion: Is it correct and relevant that his sex is female? I honestly don't know, but I suspect that it may not be. I'd love to have something better, but I'm afraid that without very, very clear policy this can be misused.
    Maybe for humans we can have a policy that only allows specifying gender and an indication of being transgender, we use "sex" only for non-humans, and statements that don't conform to this are speedily deleted. But there may be problems with this approach, too. Again, I just don't quite know. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 13:08, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    I think some of this is overthinking the issue. The most important point is that sex is rarely a relevant attribute for a human, whereas gender is. That is true of transgender people as well. And, rather than attempting to generalize at all about how transgender people work, we should instead rely on the subject's own self-identification, or reputable sources. But the current usage of P21 has been to signify the subject's gender, not sex, and there is no suggestion that once this property is implemented we would need to go in and determine everyone's sex as well. Just because most humans have a sex does not mean Wikidata needs to concern itself with describing that for every subject—just like we do not describe all of their street addresses even though there is such a property. The only relevant property for almost all humans should be gender. Sex should only be appropriate in exceedingly rare cases, and that can be explained in the property's usage guidelines, or even enforced with a constraint. Dominic (talk) 14:48, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    The most important point is that sex is rarely a relevant attribute for a human - this.
    there is no suggestion that once this property is implemented we would need to go in and determine everyone's sex as well - this, too. However, I suspect that some people will start saying that we do need to determine everyone's sex. They will be wrong, and this should be prevented as early as possible by policies.
    Sex should only be appropriate in exceedingly rare cases - yes, and maybe even never. This should be defined. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 15:30, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    Does this answer your question Amir? Amir (talk) 17:05, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    User:Ladsgroup - Yeah, mostly, thanks. It's not totally explicit there, but as far as I can see, it suggests using "sex" for non-humans and for intersex people. This makes sense, although maybe it should be more explicit.
    Can anyone think of reasons to use "sex" for non-intersex humans? Whatever the answer is, it should probably be explicit. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 17:22, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    "The most important point is that sex is rarely a relevant attribute for a human." Not true, as is clear by health aspects such as sex differences in medicine. Regardless of how one identifies, sex (rather than gender) differences matter when it comes to medicine. As for "most humans have a sex", what humans do not have a sex? Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 07:40, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
    This is relevant for a private conversation with a person's own doctor and family, and not so much on this public website.
    If a person's being transgender is verifiable and relevant as public information, it can be stated in another appropriate property, as proposed in Wikidata:WikiProject_LGBT/gender. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 08:38, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Support At Wikidata:WikiProject LGBT there is a directory of discussions at Wikidata:WikiProject LGBT/gender which demonstrate the ongoing difficulty of having a property for sex or gender. I support the split and also I support this proposed method for the split. I sympathize with the oppose votes who wish to avoid having sex and gender being repeated fields for biographies. Over years of discussion this has been a sticking point, and what is new right now is that our community has matured to the point of having enough people be able to have conversations about property proposals on Wikidata. I think now is the right time to make the switch, and even a few months ago would have been premature. The most challenging part of this change is not a Wikidata property proposal, but coming to understand that by doing this we are changing our language such that the terms "sex" and "gender" are going to have specific meanings in the Wiki community drawing from LGBT+ discussions on the topic. I encourage anyone to have conversations anywhere, but if anyone sees a conversation, please consider listing it at that LGBT+ page with the others. Also edit the LGBT+ gender page to develop the guideline. Blue Rasberry (talk) 14:42, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
I am thinking more about how we are going to assign either sex or gender to people, and when this will be original research. We have consensus to do gender assignments as original research on almost every human. We will do this based on some evaluation, presumably including whether their name is gendered, and their physical appearance often based on one photo, and then in much rarer cases when there is additional context, like the sort of information which would go into a Wikipedia article.
I am sure that I support a split of sex and gender. Sex seems natural to have; this is the property for marking what external sex organ a person has. We usually will not have that information, and instead probably will label most biographies by gender presentation which we determine by original research. Hmmm! Blue Rasberry (talk) 14:29, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
Yep, you get it. As a non-binary trans person I've been dealing with these issues in daily life as well as online for years. It gives me a real headache but it is important to get it right. Funcrunch (talk) 15:32, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Support from a purely semantic position, these are two different concepts, which require two different properties to meaningfully describe them. This is fairly obvious with some simple thought experiments, such as "Are there any subjects where the values would not be the same?" or "Are there subjects where one property would be appropriate, but the other would not be?". As a general rule, we do not combine distinct attributes into a single property and then distinguish which one is meant with a qualifier. So, something must be done about it.

    I would also point out that the idea that sex and gender can be represented as a single property means Wikidata is itself using fairly loaded language on a huge number of items, including sensitive ones. We have a practice of referring to certain people as, for example "transgender female," but do not generally identify people as "cisgender male". A person's gender should be reflected in a property with a value consisting only of their gender—regardless of what that is—without reference to their genitalia or sex. The fact that we only take this approach of conflating distinct concepts with a single property for sex/gender is troubling. To me, this seems important not only out of respect for the subjects we describe, but also to be a welcoming editor community for all who would want to participate and could be rightfully put off by how we talk about gender currently. Dominic (talk) 14:48, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

  •   Support per Dominic, though as a trans person I am concerned as others have mentioned that some editors will still unnecessarily add differing "sex" attributes to trans people, insisting that our birth-assigned sexes be listed even though our genders differ from these. ETA: Most trans people prefer to avoid the term "biological sex", which is often used to invalidate our genders. Though "assigned sex" might not be appropriate in the case of non-human animals, another term should be considered for the description of this property. Funcrunch (talk) 15:35, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose Too late. sex or gender (P21) is already used in hundreds of templates in 100+ languages, changing anything now is just a very bad idea.--Jklamo (talk) 16:10, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    That's not a valid reason, We deprecated a property that was used in millions of places (P106 IIRC). This is definitely smaller change than that one. Amir (talk) 16:58, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    @Jklamo: Only about 10,000 existing uses of sex or gender (P21) would need to be migrated. Kaldari (talk) 17:07, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    It is. Are going to go through all templates using sex or gender (P21) (in 100+ languages) and distinguish if it is appropriate to use "genderfied" sex or gender (P21) on new property (even for languages, that do not differentiate gender and sex at all)? Widely used properties need to be as stable as possible.--Jklamo (talk) 13:36, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Support per Dominic; this would correct a very visible departure from the general "items and properties should not conflate distinct entities" ethos. Also, this would make it easier for tools to accidentally do the right thing with regards to gender, handling transgender females as females and transgender males as males unless there was some need to specifically query sex. Vahurzpu (talk) 16:47, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Support Sex and gender are different concepts, so we should have properties for both. MBH (talk) 16:53, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose So is the purpose of this to give harassers an avenue to call trans women "male organisms", or is that just an acceptable side effect? There is no reason to distinguish "biological sex" and "gender" for people unless you think documenting people's genitalia or chromosomes is relevant and not an extreme invasion of privacy. Please don't respond to this if it's just to tell me "but you are a male organism".--Alexandra IDVtalk 16:58, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    User:Alexandra IDV, this is my concern as well, but see User:Ladsgroup's response above. It mostly addresses this problem, although I think it should be more explicit. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 17:22, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
  • "consensus was reached" That's not how consensus works. I'm surprised to see such an attempt. Hence oppose, at least until there is a meaningful discussion on the matter. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:03, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Weak support But biological gender need to be at birth, and gender must be current.46.188.23.100 17:19, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    What is “biological gender” supposed to be? Can you clarify what you mean? --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 00:55, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Support They are different concepts. As someone said above, following the recommendations laid here Wikidata:WikiProject LGBT/gender would be important. Scann (talk) 19:00, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose This concept is to complex to be described with such tools as our properties. To describe all the shades and tints of this, you have to use text. So no, out of scope! 62 etc (talk) 19:04, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    Certainly it’s complex, but we can try to do the best we can with the tools we have. Do you think a split into separate “gender” and “sex” properties would be worse than the current situation where they’re conflated in a single “sex or gender” property? --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 00:55, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
    "the best we can" will not even be close to good, as soon as we go outside the non-binary. Not even the biological thing is easy to describe here as soon as we reach outside of the binary. But in those cases we can at least describe them in terms of medical conditions. 62 etc (talk) 07:38, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Support for split. sex or gender (P21) should stay for distingusih, if object is male or female sex (Q290) (at birth) - majority of uses. The new property should be for storing information, that someone feels as female, but according chromosomes is male, somebody is transsexual and other weird uses (gender (Q48277) (minority of uses). JAn Dudík (talk) 21:46, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
    What do you mean by “majority of uses”? All of the wiki projects I’m aware of primarily refer to trans and nonbinary people by their gender, not their sex. (Also, in the spirit of assuming good faith, I should let you know that your comment reads as very transphobic to me, whether intentional or not, and if that was not the intention I suggest you clarify it and avoid phrases like weird uses.) --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 00:55, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  • Comment - while we need to acknowledge "those" types of people, at this point I feel as if they are still debating amongst themselves with what the proper terminology should be. Therefore it would be premature for institutions to make changes. Quakewoody (talk)
After reading continual comments from others, I can't help but want to repeat myself - at this point I feel as if they are still debating amongst themselves with what the proper terminology should be. Therefore it would be premature for institutions to make changes. And I can't help but point out 2 things.
  1. A major US city decided on 31 pronouns which angered the activists who wanted at least 101.
  2. The entire point of being "fluid" instead of being binary is not just to prevent falling into a "category" (which exactly what we are trying to do here, forcing them to be a label), but it is also changeable at a moment's notice - like a river, the river itself will always be there but it will never be the same water because it is constantly changing, aka fluid
So, for us, what exactly are we trying to do? Label something that doesn't want to be labeled. Name something that can be renamed before we even finish naming it. Quakewoody (talk)
@Quakewoody: regarding that first point… would you mind clarifying how it’s at all relevant to this proposal? And which city is this supposed to have been – do you have a source for this story? --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 22:35, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Comment I’m confused by the Motivation section of this proposal. It correctly notes that there have been many years and debate and discussion, which I’ve sadly not been very active in (though I believe it picked up around Wikimania this year?) – but then why does it only link to a discussion that had no new comments since 2013? Other people here have already linked to Wikidata:WikiProject LGBT/gender – is there a reason why this was not mentioned in the proposal from the beginning? --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 00:55, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
    • Mainly just because that page wasn't as fleshed out at the time. Kaldari (talk) 22:05, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
  •   Question How would trans people be modeled once this property exists and Property:P21 has been adjusted accordingly? Would a trans woman have gender female (Q6581072) and sex male (Q6581097)? Wikidata:WikiProject LGBT/gender assumes the existence of a “transgender status” property, but I haven’t seen a property proposal for that yet.
More specifically, I’m not convinced that using “sex” in that way would be correct. I believe some people argue that “biological sex”, as a collection of multiple features (not limited to chromosomes), also changes over the course of transition: hormone replacement therapy may change a person’s hormonal balance and, over time, their secondary sex characteristics (e. g. trans women growing breasts and trans men’s voice dropping), and gender confirmation surgery may alter their primary or secondary sex organs as well. The current form of this proposal doesn’t make it clear to me how (or whether at all) this would be represented. (Changing the property to “birth sex” would resolve that question, but would fail to account for intersex people who only discover their condition later in life, I think.) --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 00:55, 10 December 2019 (UTC) (Same disclaimer as Amir E. Aharoni above – please let me know if I’ve written something stupid or insensitive, that was not my intention.)
@Lucas Werkmeister: Those are great questions. The currently proposed data model at Wikidata:WikiProject LGBT/gender (which this proposal is related to), suggests that a trans woman would have gender female (Q6581072), but no "sex" property set unless for some reason it was notable and verifiable. I admit that there is some uncertainty about how that would actually play out, and we will need to create some guidelines around it to make sure that it isn't used in ways that are disrespectful to trans folks. Also, you are correct that there is not yet a proposal for a "transgender status" property, mainly just because it's easier to manage one proposal at a time, but anyone is welcome to make such a proposal at any time. My hope is that if we can introduce a "transgender status" property, people will use that rather than trying to use the "sex" property to indicate that someone is transgender. Hope that answers some of your questions, and feel free to propose improvements to the data model. Any constructive input is welcome. Kaldari (talk) 23:01, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
  •   Weak support since this is a generally sensible proposal, but I’d like to upgrade it to {{Support}} or {{Strong support}} once my questions above have been answered. --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 00:55, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Strong support new property “sex”, but   Oppose renaming of sex or gender (P21).   Comment A separate, new property “gender” should be created, with suggested uses in something like the following fashion:
    sex or gender (P21) to be kept or used for statements stemming from cultural contexts where there is or was no clear distinction between sex and gender in the modern-day anglophone Western sense (if there are, or should arise, other sex-and-gender-related properties that are more culturally relevant on a case-by-case basis, these could of course be used as well); as well as in the case of unreferenced statements that make it impossible to discern whether sex or gender was intended, or where references exist but have not (yet) been followed up to confirm.
    The new “gender” property to be used in contexts and with intents that clearly distinguish between sex and gender in the senses implied here.
    BlaueBlüte (talk) 08:37, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose My language (swedish) does not have separate words for "sex" and "gender", both are "kön" (unless "sex" is a verb, then it is "sex" in swedish too). We get along just fine without any distinction between the two. /ℇsquilo 12:11, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
    In Russian it's unclear too. "Пол" (sex) and "гендер" (gender) are believed to be synonymic. As the term of "гендер" is actively pushing by feminist activists as the replacement for "пол", "гендер" is sometimes perceived with some irony (I'm not sharing this). The language problem is important. Not all not non-English-speaking users are using Wikidata with their local languages, but some people do, and may have a confusion. --Wolverène (talk) 13:18, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
    Sex and gender are synonymic in every language, because for the many people, gender is how you represent your sex. The term ‘гендер’ is perfectly valid term in Russian social science to describe everything that ‘пол’ can’t. Transphobia associated with it in colloquial usage is nothing to be concerned about in Wikidata or any other encyclopaedic project. I agree that adding ‘пол’ (sex) property might be really bad if it is allowed for usage for most humans, however. stjn[ru] 16:33, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
    @Esquilo: I think we in Swedish have "kön" and "könsidentitet". But I doubt there is a 1:1-fit to the English words sex and gender here. 62 etc (talk) 07:33, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
    Judging by the description of "sex" and "gender" in English, the distinction is totally different. If we introduce this property as it is described, it will have to replace sex or gender (P21) in 99,99% of all objects where it is used. /ℇsquilo 07:39, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
    There is a Russian word that is forgotten in this discussion, and it is relevant for other languages, too. In English, "gender" has been used for a long time mostly for grammatical gender—a linguistic property that is sometimes, but not always, related to biological sex. The Russian language has a separate word for it: род.
    In recent decades, "gender" in English began to be used for the social and psychological concept of gender, which may be different from what a person is assigned at birth according to how their body looks like. This word is also used as a loanword neologism in some languages, including Russian, and then it may be associated with a certain narrative that not everyone understands, and with which not everyone agrees.
    In practice, I could find two actual uses for the sex/gender property, at least as far as it concerns humans:
    1. Using the correct word according to the gender, if the language requires is. This may apply to English, too, for example actor/actress, and in many other languages it is needed in many more words. This is totally related to the grammatical gender sense.
    2. Running queries for people who appear on Wikidata and have a certain occupation, live in a certain country, have or don't have a Wikipedia article, and sorting them by gender. An often-repeated example is "What is the biggest city in the world the mayor of which is a woman?". This is useful for statistics, editathons, verifying data integrity, etc. Here, a human's sex is also irrelevant, and a gender-only propoerty can do this job perfectly. If someone wants to look up transgender mayors, this can be covered by another property, as already proposed in Wikidata:WikiProject_LGBT/gender. (It makes sense to me to also cover intersex people in a separate property, so neither gender nor sex would be used for that, although I might be wrong.)
    There may be other use cases, but I cannot think of any at the moment.
    So, one solution to translate the name of the property unambigusly can be to use the word that is used for describing grammatical gender.
    For languages in which this doesn't work well, perhaps gender could be translated as something like "human sex" or "social sex" and "sex" could be something like "animal sex" or "biological sex". However, this would further strengthen the requirement to not use "sex" for humans at all. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 11:06, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Strong oppose if it will be something that would be applied to everyone, because it will just be a lot of WD:BLP violations, an area where Wikidata is already very lax right now and the open invitation to bigots wouldn’t discourage it one bit. Support the renaming of ‘sex or gender’ into ‘gender’ and splitting off a separate ‘sex’ property for animals. As for problems when dealing with intersex people, I think the more kind solution is to do something like gender: female / biological trait: intersex (and maybe even gender: female / biological trait: transgender) or use the same schema trans people currently use. stjn[ru] 16:33, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose It's not clear how do we define "sex" for someone without access to their medical records. What if they are intersex but aren't aware of that? People are not routinely karyotyped. If we become suddenly very interested in whether a person is intersex or not, every male confessing to have hypospadias will be assigned "intersex" sex without any practical reason whatsoever etc. It is also unclear why do we need to state the sex altogether since Wikipedia is not a medical data library. Le Loy (talk) 20:10, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  • Wikidata is partly a medical data library. We host a lot of data that's of interest to the medical community. Wikidata generally works in a way to allow different people to use it for different purposes. ChristianKl❫ 11:17, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
What if they are intersex but aren’t aware of that? Then we have no statement. This property is, per the motivation section, for cases where the sex is notably different from the gender, which to me presupposes that the two are known to differ. If someone goes through their entire life without being aware of being intersex, I’d say their sex isn’t notable and we don’t need a statement for it. As for hypospadias, I’m not familiar with the condition, but enwiki says the presence of hypospadias alone is not enough to classify a person as intersex, so I don’t see why that would constitute a “sex” statement either. (I suppose it would be a medical condition (P1050), if publicly known, notable and not in conflict with WD:BLP.) --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 22:46, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

  Comment I am afraid, there is one big misunderstanding. In many languages is primary meaning of sex or gender (P21) in biological sense (male, female). And the word gender have the psycho-sociological meaning (trans- and others). English maybe now prefer word gender for the first case, but majority of non-english speakers means this word for second case.

It seems to me, there is support for splitting this property, but P21 should stay binary (and biological) (male, female, hermaphrodite) and the new one should be for other cases (trans*, neutral, intersex, genderqueer, etc..) Do you agree? JAn Dudík (talk) 08:49, 11 December 2019 (UTC)

  • Most Western languages do mean gender in the social sense. Whether you use "he" or "she" to refer to a person is about how you interact with them in a sociological sense. It's important that a data user like Siri can deduce the gender of a person to use the right grammatical forms when speaking about a person. This is an important usecase that any solution shouldn't break. ChristianKl❫ 11:29, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose This is clearly a well-intentioned proposal, but I think creating a mechanism to say that someone has sex A but gender B is actually a mistake and a step backward. This proposal fails the most important criterion for a a wiki system, it is not idiot-proof (Q12981895) and would invite abuse. See a much more amenable propsal at Property talk:P21#New proposal, which is I think 80% of where we want to get to.--Pharos (talk) 04:34, 13 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose Same meaning in too many Asian languages, if there are some little languages who consider both as different, better to use qualifiers to handle. --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 04:49, 13 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Strong support We can't stop to add data because some people thinks that it could be subject of harassment, or because some languages don't have right words for describing the property. --Tinker Bell 04:18, 14 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Weak oppose in favour of several more specific properties or community-recommended property-qualifier combination patterns, and possible restriction to nonhumans as discussed above. Both humans and nonhumans have many measurements that collectively constitute sex, and these can contradict or even have little to do with one another (karyotypes were mentioned, but there are also sex-linked genes on the autosomal chromosomes for which sequencing or genotyping is the test, and there are macroanatomical measures as well such as the configuration of genitalia). I concur with the sentiment mentioned that ultimately the number of entities for which any of those measurements would be useful/appropriate for publication is limited (which is not in and of itself a reason to deny property creation, since that presents an opportunity for exhaustive documentation; but is important to keep in mind during discussion). Arlo Barnes (talk) 22:12, 30 December 2019 (UTC)
  •   Oppose. While we need to have a certain level of cultural sensitivity towards those cultures which place priority on gender identity and consider biological sex to be a private and mostly irrelevant matter, we can't reasonably duplicate the entire P21 dataset of millions of statements, nor can we just prohibit all data on gender identity or otherwise limit our work to one cultural viewpoint. We can't just take the approach of blood type (P1853) (where part of the world considers it a basic fact about the person, and the rest consider it a private medical matter). Situations where the proposed property would add differences are sufficiently unusual that which we're able to handle with one property without difficulty. The close of a small six-year-old thread does not make consensus, or override all the much larger discussions on the topic since. --Yair rand (talk) 12:49, 31 December 2019 (UTC)
    • @Yair rand: There would not be a need to duplicate the P21 dataset. P21 would simply be renamed "gender", and "sex" would only be used in rare circumstances (notable individual animals, intersex persons, etc.). What larger discussions on this topic would this proposal override? Kaldari (talk) 22:01, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
      • Just as the fact that some cultures consider gender to be significant means that we can't universally omit that data, the fact that many cultures consider sex to be significant means that we can't universally omit that data either. We've had endless discussion of this, including much from the discussions surrounding the original change from P21 being labelled just "sex" to "sex or gender". --Yair rand (talk) 00:23, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
  •   Strong oppose In Polish (Q809) there is no clear distinction between the "gender" and "sex" nouns when it comes to describing person's gender or sex. Simillar to @Esquilo, Wolverène: I do not see how this would help this community. Nadzik (talk) 15:03, 23 January 2020 (UTC)
    • I am also not sure if discussion with only few opinions (last comment being from 2013) and closed in 2019 counts as en:Consensus decision-making Nadzik (talk) 15:06, 23 January 2020 (UTC)
      • We should also remember that splitting "gender" and "sex" may allow trolls to harass intersex people on Wikidata. It would just require to assign to an intersex person this property with "male organism" or "female organism". Nadzik (talk) 15:37, 23 January 2020 (UTC)
    • @Nadzik: I don't think your assertion is correct. While there is no native Polish term for gender, it seems the Polish language has borrowed the English term in order to establish such a distinction. Polish Wikipedia has separate articles for pl:Gender and pl:Płeć, and it's easy to find websites in Polish that discuss the difference between the two concepts, such as this. In fact, it seems that the University of Warsaw named "gender" the Word of the Year back in 2013: http://www.slowanaczasie.uw.edu.pl/slowo-roku-2013/. Kaldari (talk) 11:51, 28 January 2020 (UTC)
    • @Nadzik: leaving aside the question of whether Polish really has no way to express this distinction (see Kaldari’s comment above), or whether it will stay that way (languages evolve, after all): I don’t think this is a valid argument against the property proposal. Just because Polish, or any language for that matter, doesn’t have separate terms for two concepts, doesn’t mean that we can’t be allowed to distinguish between these concepts at all. For instance, English does not distinguish between human and animal/plant sexes; but because some languages do (see archived discussion), Wikidata has separate items for male (Q6581097) and male organism (Q44148), as well as for female (Q6581072) and female organism (Q43445), even though their English labels can only express that difference by tacking an additional descriptor (“organism”) onto the same base word (“male”/“female”). --Lucas Werkmeister (talk) 00:55, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
  •   Strong support I think the current property is ambigious. It should align with what the source says (or implies) in the cultural context of the source. For better or worse, English speakers have two ways to describe what may be the same thing in other languages. If that is the case, they can pick whichever one is most appropriate. U+1F360 (talk) 03:49, 16 February 2020 (UTC)
  •   CommentThis proposal starts with an entirely incorrect premise: that "consensus was reached" in the discussion at Property_talk:P21#Separate_fields_for_'sex'_and_'gender'. However that discussion with only about five participants took place not 'in many years', but in October and November 2013. At that time, P21 was just about 'sex', whatever that meant. In the meantime, there was a much longer discussion at Property_talk:P21#Transgender_.2F_Cisgender_changes with more participants, many viewpoints and aspects and a clear conclusion in Januari 2014, hence after the above, to combine bots aspects in one property P21 named 'gender or sex'. It is I think this proposal has a false start, so I am inclined to vote   Oppose because Kaldari didn't address the issues brought up earlier. The proposal should go back to the talk page. Bever (talk) 02:36, 16 April 2020 (UTC)
    • I undid the 'closing' of a discussion which was long overdue. Also, I think I agree more with the arguments contra than pro. Certainly agreeing that a sensible way of getting along with this issue is needed, I am not convinced that a new property is the right way.
    1. What was actually wrong with having more than 1 value for a person in one property, using qualifiers, like discussed here and already possible (although a constraint violation message pops up).
    2. Having two properties is not 'foolproof', as somebody above already warned, as many users will confuse both properties and put the data at the wrong place. Also note that other languages than English often use the same word in both meanings, using adjectives or compound nouns when needed. Also I fear that having two properties makes Wikidata more vulnerable for vandalism by people opposing the 'gender ideology' as they call it.
    3. The idea seems to be to use the new property only for people where having different values for sex and gender would be relevant. Not only this could be achieved with qualifiers in P21 as well, it means emphasizing transgender and intersex people as an exception, so it is not a step forward for gender diversity, although it is meant that way. See also this remark at Wikidata:WikiProject LGBT/gender: "that notability criterion would seem to easily skew toward notability of transness and non-notability of cisness".
    4. When a historical person gave birth to a child, it is reasonable to conclude that she was a woman, biologically. The gender identity (as far as that aspect did aspect at the time) might be unknown. For people in recent time, it might be the other way around. Therefore the property 'sex or gender' combines both, so it can be filled for most people.
    5. In fact there are even more than 2 sides to 'sex/gender': gender identification, gender expression, legal gender, chromosomal sex, birth sex, hormonal sex, and having certain organs. Therefore I still tend to think using more than one value (when needed) in one property is the best choice. Bever (talk) 03:18, 16 April 2020 (UTC)
  •   Weak support: No rename. A long transition period would be needed. While we are at it, it might make sense for them to be "sex" and "gender identity". I think we would need a more detailed proposal and guidelines before doing this, hence the weak support. This topic is highly controversial nowadays, and going for it without decent guidelines would result in infinite warring. --MarioGom (talk) 16:03, 30 April 2020 (UTC)
  •   Oppose In the rare event that we know the person's sex in addition to their gender, we can specify that with items like cisgender male (Q15145778), transgender male (Q2449503), assigned female at birth (Q99485785), etc. Sex and gender are indeed separate concepts, but the line between them is fuzzy and having two properties would just create confusion. –IagoQnsi (talk) 17:12, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
  •   Comment those interested in this discussion may also be interested in the conversation on Project Chat about using <subclass of> “male” or “female” for pairs and groups of people. - PKM (talk) 21:42, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
  •   Support two different concepts, two properties Nepalicoi (talk) 08:02, 4 October 2021 (UTC)
  •   Weak support I think this separation is a good idea. I also think we should add a property which is "gender modality" [1][2][3][4]. Examples of gender modality (which is a different concept than gender identity) include cisgender and transgender. With this in mind, I think we could programmatically support separation of "transgender female" into gender modality "transgender" and gender "female". For instance, Kim Petras (Q60964) currently has "sex or gender" as "transgender female". Her gender is just "female" though (and should be noted as such), meaning that her gender modality ("transgender") will no longer be included. This will also help facilitate programmatic searching for cis men, cis women, trans men, and trans women, women (including cis and trans), and men (including cis and trans) without misidentifying their gender. Superraptor123 (talk) 15:20, 8 October 2021 (UTC)
  •   Support must have. Worldm99 (talk) 18:18, 22 October 2021 (UTC)
  •   Oppose i don't see a problem with the current situation BrokenSegue (talk) 16:34, 7 November 2021 (UTC)
  •   Comment When will we reach consensus? let me summarise the votes:
Votes regarding creating a new property "sex"
weak oppose 2 weak support 5
oppose 11 support 11
strong oppose 2 strong support 3
Total Oppose 15 Total Support 19

Would anyone like to reconsider, so we can move forward? @Jura1, GZWDer, Robin van der Vliet, Kaldari, Lucas Werkmeister, Ladsgroup: Germartin1 (talk) 23:28, 6 January 2022 (UTC)

    • @Germartin1: I’m inclined to close this discussion as unsuccessful. There’s clearly no consensus for this. --Emu (talk) 10:36, 16 April 2022 (UTC)
  •   Oppose for all humans except intersex, per Alexandra IDV.   Weak support for non-humans and intersex humans only (and specific cases where the person is happy and comfortable with that distinction) , with explicit rule, per Wikidata:WikiProject_LGBT/gender#About_this_model and Amire80.-- Darwin Ahoy! 13:58, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
  • If we have a sex property, I think it makes sense to formulate it in a way where it can be used for items like female breast cancer (Q18553389) and female urethra (Q66510973) as well. ChristianKl❫ 10:52, 29 March 2022 (UTC)
  •   Oppose, there are far too many questions about implementation, it could make things slightly better or significantly worse, so i think it's best to leave things as-is. Also, any ideas about how certain fictional nonhumans would be dealt with? having certain policies for humans feels like it would bring up some annoying edge cases. Binarycat64 (talk) 18:32, 22 May 2022 (UTC)

context of deathEdit

MotivationEdit

Prior discussion: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Project_chat#How_should_we_note_that_George_Floyd_(Q95677819)_was_killed_by_police?

We currently have no good way to model the context in which a person died. As a result it's not listed on items such as George Floyd (Q95677819) which makes it hard to query for all instances of US police violence. Sometimes constructions with instance of (P31) are used for holocaust victims but it would be more desireable to not overload instance of (P31) for those as well and have a decidated property.

I used the new item US police violence (Q96442197) to be able to neutrally describe a situation without making a judgement about whether the use of force is excessive (given that's criminal, such claims should ideally be sourced with court judgements). It might be possible to import data about fatal shootings from https://github.com/washingtonpost/data-police-shootings which make no judgement about whether or not the use of force was justified or excessive.

I put the country in the item because it's not just important that a US citizen was killed but also that the killing happened in the US. We might also have narrower items for individual cities. ChristianKl❫ 11:07, 19 June 2020 (UTC)


DiscussionEdit

  •   Support. I've felt we needed something like this for a long time. I've added a couple more examples of how it could be used - someone who died during a specific battle, a rebellion, a disaster. Some items use eg "cause of death" for things like this but that's not strictly right, I think. Andrew Gray (talk) 12:31, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
    • Those examples seem good. ChristianKl❫ 22:39, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
  •   Neutral; sounds a bit vague. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 16:59, 19 June 2020 (UTC).
  •   Comment. I have never fully understood the difference between cause of death (P509) and manner of death (P1196), having always been trying to understand which one of the two is supposed to do what the proposal suggests a third property should. So I guess I have my answer now – none of them so far! Thierry Caro (talk) 20:56, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
  • There's prior art in http://sparql.cwrc.ca/ontology/cwrc.html#DeathContext . Given our general naming I like expressing it like I did in the proposal. ChristianKl❫ 14:14, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
  •   Comment for a specific event it makes sense, like a battle, however generally "(US) Police violence" doesn't seem to fit, why not George Floyd protests (Q95965839) ~~
George Floyd (Q95677819) didn't die in George Floyd protests (Q95965839). His death caused George Floyd protests (Q95965839) which is a very different relationship. It also doesn't help with the use-case of querying for people who died to US police violence. ChristianKl❫ 14:58, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
Yes true, I was just seeing it the social context, so why US police violence, not police violence in general or why not Black Lives matter Germartin1 (talk) 16:52, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
Given subclass relationships you can query for police violence (Q96441150) even when the item is noted as US police violence. If you only care for Black victim you can narrow your query via ethnic group (Q41710). I consider it very desireable that there's a clear way to query for all deaths by police violence in a certain city and that would not be possible by setting the context as Black Lives matter. That said, I don't think there should be a single value constraint and it's fine if somebody who likes to think in terms of Black Lives matter and maybe also care for violence that's not directly done by police officiers where Black people are victims to set Black Lives matter as an additional value. ChristianKl❫ 17:27, 20 June 2020 (UTC)
  •   Support more to the point than "significant event" that is currently used a lot to model this. All for it! Moebeus (talk) 16:43, 22 June 2020 (UTC)
  •   Comment I'm not sure. I would use it for the project I'm working on collecting profiles from newspapers on Covid-19 victims but I think I would also continue to add it as a significant event since there are also profiles on people who recover, and it remains a significant event to those they leave behind. The entire group of people impacted by an event can be tagged the same way. That a significant event strongly correlated with the person's death can already be deduced from the proximity in time. 1Veertje (talk) 09:36, 1 July 2020 (UTC)
I think systematic use of "significant event" would work as an alternative, but only if we can work out a consistent qualifier to clearly say "death connected to this event", and I don't think we currently have that. Relying on making the connection by date would get tricky for things with very long time-spans (eg it would be good to record people who died in the context of the Troubles (Q815436), but that lasted 30+ years) and might not be possible for generic events without specific timeframes like "police violence". Andrew Gray (talk)
Samples:
  • cancer death: #1/#2 we have a reference for both, #3: use "cause of death",
  • red heads killed on Mondays: #1 references are available, if #2 would be a yes, #3 would indicate to query manner of death, date of death and hair color instead. --- Jura 17:15, 14 May 2021 (UTC)
  •   Strong oppose. The 'context of death' is rarely an obvious thing. Anne Frank, for instance, was clearly a victim of the Holocaust, but equally validly the victim of antisemitism in general, German antisemitism in particular, xenophobia at its most general and Nazism in particular. And that's a clear-cut case in comparison with instances where one context is the pretext or means of another, such as a regime forcibly conscripting a certain ethnic group, or where multiple parties have different contexts to effect someone's death. For the latter, consider the killing of Hafizullah Amin (Q63831) as part of Operation Storm-333 (Q975430): the proximate contexts alone are numerous – the dispute between the Khalq and the Parcham, rivalries inside the Khalq, the Soviet Union's desire for a more reliable leader in Afghanistan, Soviet expansionism and so on. The biggest problem is that these reasons can often be quite controversial in a way that is not capable of sensible resolution. If Country A attacks Country B in retaliation for Country B's claimed violations of its sovereignty, is the death of an A-ese soldier at the hand of a B-ian unit taking place in the context of 'B's aggression against A', the 'A-B war' or 'A's aggression against B'? There's a Pandora's box here that is best left unopened. Equally, there might be quite valid disagreement as to the attribution of systemic causes. Bonnie and Clyde were in a sense victims of police violence, and in a sense their deaths also took place in the context of a crime spree they were wholly responsible for. I am unsure if this concept, as broad as it is, could be useful. Narrower incarnations, such as 'died at/in' (for battles, events, terrorist attacks and the like) could cover some ground. So could 'notable events'. The issue of deaths is already controversial enough, e.g. a number of people murdered during purges or the Holocaust were killed under the color of law and so their manner of death lists 'capital punishment' when arguably murder might be more appropriate. Including the context of death would invite a much more complex situation. Ari T. Benchaim (talk) 00:21, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
  • @Ari T. Benchaim: how would your samples pass through the tests suggested above? --- Jura 16:43, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
  • The fact that you can make broader and less broad claims is generally true for a lot of relationships in Wikidata. We usually take by convention the most specific one. ChristianKl❫ 21:10, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
@ChristianKl: I appreciate that. My key concern is that there can be more than insignificant disagreement - and valid disagreement at that - as to what the most specific cause is. Is the Nazi repression of dissent or the German resistance the more 'proximate' context of the Scholls' deaths, for instance?

background of deathEdit

MotivationEdit

Currently we cannot link a person with the event that led to their death. The property name in English may not be the right one but the objective of this property is to store the historical event during which death occurred. As such, it's different from Wikidata:Property proposal/context of death that intends to store the "societal context" of death. Ayack (talk) 10:08, 27 April 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Support Ayack (talk) 10:08, 27 April 2022 (UTC)
  •   Oppose I know it might be verbose, but we already have many properties for causes and effects: has cause (P828) can be used for any event that ultimately causes an effect: Charb (Q2957653) significant event (P793) death (Q4) / has cause (P828) Charlie Hebdo shooting (Q18718876). A more specific property is has immediate cause (P1478), for events that are more proximately related. Anyway, both properties can be used in many events, not just for deaths. cause of death (P509) shouldn't be used in this case, this property indicates the physical condition that ultimately causes the death on a person, in this case, ballistic trauma (Q2140674). --Tinker Bell 05:47, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
  •   Comment This would be an inverse property for victim (P8032); I can see a need for events that have a large number of victims, as it's better to document this in the reverse direction rather than have a long list attached to the event. However Tinker Bell's approach seems fine to me there. For events with only a few victims this is an unnecessary inverse. ArthurPSmith (talk) 15:06, 28 April 2022 (UTC)
  • To discuss this well we actually need a good English property name and description and talk about the scope. The current proposal is quite unclear about the scope.ChristianKl❫ 20:34, 7 May 2022 (UTC)

User accountEdit

IdentifierEdit

OpenStates Person IDEdit

   Under discussion
DescriptionIdentifier for person entries in OpenStates.org
Representsperson
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Allowed valuesocd-person\b\/[0-9a-fA-F]{8}\b-[0-9a-fA-F]{4}\b-[0-9a-fA-F]{4}\b-[0-9a-fA-F]{4}\b-[0-9a-fA-F]{12}
Example 1Rick Outman (Q7331626) → ocd-person/9c525554-fb85-45f3-87fa-cf6a3208ce32
Example 2Adam Hollier (Q76373561) → ocd-person/5417a310-a276-4035-8dc8-f536c61db49d
Example 3Jeff Irwin (Q16216607) → ocd-person/a1c1163d-af8d-4b88-9365-07717d4a45c3
Example 4Kevin Daley (Q16730764) → ocd-person/cf7ed8de-2df4-41ff-9dcb-489980b031a0
Sourcehttps://openstates.org/data/
Planned useCross-linking of Wikidata and OpenStates.org data. Used in initial resolving of entities via Mix-n-match followed by verification of (party, given name, family name, district) and sync of external IDs. The resolved Wikidata Q will be added as a new field to OpenStates for cross linking between Wikidata and OpenStates entities.
Number of IDs in source7997 as of 20220128
Expected completenessalways incomplete (Q21873886)
Robot and gadget jobsChecking properties for consistency and cross check changes in data
Applicable "stated in"-valueOpen States (Q54449686)
Distinct-values constraintyes
Wikidata projectThe ID intersects with Wikiproject Every politician's goal for persons holding positions in the US Government federal, state, and local levels.

MotivationEdit

Existing data collection and cleaning of common political figure data by OpenStates as CC0 which does not currently interface with Wikidata, but directly aligns with the goals of Wikiproject Every Politician. Adding a property for an OpenStates people ID enables a bidirectional linking, import, and checks against the data work by both the Wikidata community and OpenStates. This may help with updates after each U.S. election or event. This may also assist with easier use of related Wikidata entries and Wikimedia properties through the existing notable consumers of OpenStates. Wolfgang8741 (talk) 22:32, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

A point of discussion to complement this proposal is how best to capture both the UUID and computed ID for the web URL. The UUID is ocd-person/9c525554-fb85-45f3-87fa-cf6a3208ce32 the ID for the web URL is computed from the full name and UUID as a base62 slug-hash and relies on the full name from an OpenStates entry to compute reliably. An example instance https://openstates.org/person/rick-outman-4kyQcmzxj3evAoxO2Tx3OU/. It seems it would be important to capture the UUID then compute or import the OpenStates Computed ID to link back to the OpenStates website page for the person. This may as well be done through a second property such as OpenStates Computed ID.

Consensus on this approach could enable further data linking and integration with OpenStates. OpenStates was contacted on their Slack prior to this proposal to check feasibility of integrating a WikiData ID and are open to integrating back the Wikidata Identifier to each corresponding entry. Wolfgang8741 (talk) 22:32, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

Second property for the computed ID sounds ok to me. ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:00, 1 February 2022 (UTC)
  • It would be preferable to determine a single identifier with a formatter URL that could be included in Wikidata.
BTW what happens when the spelling of a person's name is slightly changed? Does that recalculate everything? --- Jura 18:27, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
@Jura1 I agree a single identifier with a formatter URL would be ideal. After some messaging with a maintainer of OpenStates, a slug change would redirect to a canonical slug-hash ID URL. This does mean at this time that any dumps used for the import need to compute this ID from the full name key and ID key using the slug-base62 conversions of each respective field. The OpenStates API can lookup data with just the base62 hash supplied. Should I refactor the proposal based on use of the slug-hash ID and formatter URL? Example 5 would become Rick Outman (Q7331626) → rick-outman-4kyQcmzxj3evAoxO2Tx3OU for formatted link [5]https://openstates.org/person/rick-outman-4kyQcmzxj3evAoxO2Tx3OU/ and yes, the slug may have more than two dashes depending on the name of the individual, for example: [6]https://github.com/openstates/people/blob/main/data/mi/legislature/Cynthia-A-Johnson-8579a776-ec6d-4239-b1a2-5e89dd3cee49.yml Wolfgang8741 (talk) 22:58, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
@Jura1@ArthurPSmith Most of the data is now resolved to Wikidata Entities in the mix'n'match catalog 5046 pending final Proposal ID format approval. I did find in practice the redirects have a bug and still encourage including the qualifier property of the ocd-person/ format as it affords access to the underlying data while the computed URL is not included in the raw data. We can make the computed ID the primary ID and the ocd-person the qualifier ID from a constraint perspective. Wolfgang8741 (talk) 16:53, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

ChristianKl Oravrattas Tagishsimon Jacksonj04 Owenpatel Markcridge Louisecrow Nomen ad hoc Tubezlob Siwhitehouse Mhl20 Alexsdutton Danadl Teester Zache a_ka_es Hasive Nat965 masti Papuass Jklamo ProtoplasmaKid Jmmuguerza Graemebp Pete Forsyth Jelabra Rfitzel Davidpar Canley Bodhisattwa CYAN Masssly MJL tdombos salgo60 Daniel Mietchen Lefcentreright Pedropaulovc Shahadusadik ミラP Xaris333 BrokenSegue M2545 Gnoeee DrThneed Mathieu Kappler Data Gamer Dajasj ACortellari Zblace Tinker Bell Germartin1 Wolfgang8741 Philocypros Popperipopp   Notified participants of WikiProject every politician

Sauvons nos tombes person IDEdit

MotivationEdit

VIGNERON
Mathieudu68
Ayack
Benoît Prieur
Ash Crow
Tubezlob
PAC2
Thierry Caro
Pymouss
Alphos
Nomen ad hoc
GAllegre
Jean-Frédéric
Manu1400
Thibdx
Marianne Casamance
NTranchant
Nattes à chat
Pierre André
Bouzinac
Albertvillanovadelmoral
Jsamwrites
Baidax
LearnKnowGive1
Mathieu Kappler
Daieuxetdailleurs
Archives nationales DJI
Jmax
LearnKnowGive1
  Notified participants of WikiProject France. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 18:47, 15 February 2021 (UTC).

DiscussionEdit

Andrew Gray Andy Mabbett Bamyers99 Ijon Vladimir Alexiev Nomen ad hoc Epìdosis emu Alexmar983 Simon Cobb Pmt Mathieu Kappler MasterRus21thCentury Jheald   Notified participants of WikiProject Biographical IdentifiersMasterRus21thCentury (talk) 08:43, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

ANPI person IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionidentifier of a person of National Association of Italian Partisans (Q3626661)'s Web portal
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Allowed values[a-z][-a-z]*
Example 1Primo Levi (Q153670)primo-levi
Example 2Sandro Pertini (Q1233)alessandro-pertini
Example 3Rosselli brothers (Q3752399)carlo-e-nello-rosselli
Sourcehttps://www.anpi.it/donne-e-uomini
External linksUse in sister projects: [ar][de][en][es][fr][he][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Formatter URLhttps://www.anpi.it/donne-e-uomini/$1
See alsoWikidata:Property proposal/ANPI person numeric ID
Motivation

National Association of Italian Partisans (Q3626661) is the main association founded by participants of the Italian resistance against the Italian Fascist regime and the subsequent Nazi occupation during World War II. I think this would be a relevant identifier for a person.

Proposed aliases:

  • Donne e Uomini della Resistenza ID
  • Partigiani d'Italia ID
  • ANPI ID

Airon90 ValterVB Alexmar983 Epìdosis Pietro Jura Beta16 Yiyi Sannita Camelia Sentruper Pierpao Marcok CristianNX Daniele Pugliesi (WMIT) AttoRenato Parma1983 Aborruso Sabas88 Lalupa DnaX Fausta Samaritani Patafisik Malore Jtorquy Nicholas Gemini Civvì Devbug Afnecors Susanna Giaccai FabC FeltriaUrbsPicta Horcrux Uomovariabile Luckyz Francians Carlobia Ferdi2005 Luca.favorido Lemure Saltante Giacomo Alessandroni divudì Federica Gaspari   Notified participants of WikiProject Italy --Horcrux (talk) 15:19, 22 February 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

Stan Radar dossier IDEdit

   Ready Create
Descriptionидентификатор досье на портале Stan Radar (ru) – (Please translate this into English.)
Representsstanradar (Q111145689)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Example 1Vladimir Putin (Q7747)19-putin-vladimir-vladimirovich
Example 2Hu Jintao (Q15029)244-khu--tszintao
Example 3Ilham Aliyev (Q57371)241-aliev-ilkham-gejdarovich-
Sourcehttps://stanradar.com
External linksUse in sister projects: [ar][de][en][es][fr][he][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Planned usefor usage in stated in (P248) and for Template:Authority control (Q3907614)
Number of IDs in source344
Expected completenesseventually complete (Q21873974)
Formatter URLhttps://stanradar.com/bio/full/$1.html
Robot and gadget jobsYes, it would be great to have a separate mix'n'match catalog.
See alsocentrasia.org person ID (P10130)
Wikidata project{{Central Asia properties}}

MotivationEdit

Stan Radar is an information and analytical portal about Central Asia. This year he turns 20 years old. Portal text materials can be used for commercial purposes under the terms of the Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license. MasterRus21thCentury (talk) 16:35, 8 March 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

The Israeli Opera person IDEdit

   Ready Create
Descriptionidentifier for a person on The Israeli Opera website
RepresentsThe Israeli Opera (Q111507771)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Allowed values[1-9]\d*
Example 1Dan Ettinger (Q1159060) value in Hebrew 195, value in English 220
Example 2Alon Harari (Q28808085) value in Hebrew 966, value in English 651
Example 3Gabi Sade (Q16131624) value in Hebrew 183, value in English 304
Example 4Ira Bratman (Q58652151) value in Hebrew 185, value in English 236
Example 5Daniella Lugassy (Q6803369) value in Hebrew 1625, value in English 1100
Example 6Yoav Talmi (Q2918939) value in Hebrew 2232, value in English 1461
Example 7Vivian Tierney (Q24851963) value in Hebrew 2599, value in English 1641
Example 8Kent Nagano (Q819447) value in Hebrew 3110, value in English 1996
Example 9Lena Freifeld (Q111508232) value in Hebrew 5501, value in English 6253
Example 10Roman Rabinovich (Q7362147) value in English 596 (only English)
Sourcehttps://www.israel-opera.co.il/?CategoryID=181 (Hebrew) ; https://www.israel-opera.co.il/eng/?CategoryID=263 (English)
External linksUse in sister projects: [ar][de][en][es][fr][he][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Planned usehe/wiki template - תבנית:פרופילי קולנוענים-מוזיקאים
Number of IDs in source
Expected completenessalways incomplete (Q21873886)
Formatter URLhttps://www.israel-opera.co.il/?CategoryID=181&ArticleID=$1
Robot and gadget jobsWill be added manually by users from he.wiki
Applicable "stated in"-valueThe Israeli Opera (Q111507771)

MotivationEdit

New Israeli Opera (Q7210646) is the principal opera company of Israel. The Israeli Opera (Q111507771) including western classical music (Q9730) filed: directors, choreographers, conductors, sopranos, baritones, mezzo-soprano, tenors, costume designers, dancers, Piano players, Viola players etc.

notice

there are different links to id in Hebrew and English

(Hebrew) link https://www.israel-opera.co.il/?CategoryID=181&ArticleID=$1
(English) link https://www.israel-opera.co.il/eng/?CategoryID=263&ArticleID=$1

Geagea (talk) 22:53, 5 April 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Support as of now, the property proposal covers only Hebrew pages; since probably they contain more information, it seems reasonable to connect only them as of now. --Epìdosis 11:08, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
Epì, I wonder, maybe it is possible to use Formatter URL like in The Peerage person ID (P4638).
Formatter URL: https://www.israel-opera.co.il/$1 so we can use Hebrew and English id's. For example:
Dan Ettinger (Q1159060):
id for the Hebrew link: ?CategoryID=181&ArticleID=195
id for the English link: eng/?CategoryID=263&ArticleID=220
Geagea (talk) 22:56, 9 April 2022 (UTC)
It could be, probably. @ArthurPSmith: for https://wikidata-externalid-url.toolforge.org/. --Epìdosis 22:59, 9 April 2022 (UTC)
@Geagea, Epìdosis: What Geagea proposes doesn't require the external-id formatter, but if you want to shorten the id's then that would be an option too - for example 'he:195' vs 'en:220' perhaps? ArthurPSmith (talk) 14:43, 11 April 2022 (UTC)
@ArthurPSmith: you are right. I would support shortening, it seems much better (e.g. The Cardinals of the Holy Roman Church ID (P7619)). --Epìdosis 14:52, 11 April 2022 (UTC)
I support this but how you are making the magic? Geagea (talk) 15:01, 11 April 2022 (UTC)
Writing some php code :) ArthurPSmith (talk) 15:07, 11 April 2022 (UTC)
We will be able to use this "magic" in wikipedia in easy way? if yes, I am ok with this. - yona b (talk) 06:30, 12 April 2022 (UTC)
  •   Support for the reasons above. בורה בורה (talk) 02:57, 1 May 2022 (UTC)
  •   Support Effib (talk) 12:10, 1 May 2022 (UTC)
  •   Support for all of the reasons above.לוכסן (talk) 17:25, 1 May 2022 (UTC)
  •   Support Created mix'n'match catalogs 5267 and 5268 --Gerwoman (talk) 18:34, 12 June 2022 (UTC)
  •   Comment Huh, I hadn't thought about this carefully when I commented before. Since the ID's are completely different for the Hebrew and English pages I think we need two property proposals here. I don't think there's any fiddling you can do with formatter URL's to fix the problem of having two different ID's for the same person. ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:12, 17 June 2022 (UTC)

belfercenter person IDEdit

   Under discussion
Data typeExternal identifier
Example 1Jairam Ramesh (Q907912)jairam-ramesh
Example 2Nelly Lahoud (Q111750397)nelly-lahoud
Example 3MISSING
Formatter URLhttps://www.belfercenter.org/person/$1

MotivationEdit

(Add your motivation for this property here.) Germartin1 (talk) 02:21, 29 April 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

France bleu journalist IDEdit

   Ready Create
Descriptionidentifier for a journalist on France bleu website
RepresentsFrance Bleu (Q19906)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Example 1Wendy Bouchard (Q3567240)wendy-bouchard
Example 2Fabienne Bureau (Q64592059)fabienne-bureau
Example 3Leila Mebarek (Q111974125)leila-mebarek
Formatter URLhttps://www.francebleu.fr/les-equipes/$1

VIGNERON
Mathieudu68
Ayack
Benoît Prieur
Ash Crow
Tubezlob
PAC2
Thierry Caro
Pymouss
Alphos
Nomen ad hoc
GAllegre
Jean-Frédéric
Manu1400
Thibdx
Marianne Casamance
NTranchant
Nattes à chat
Pierre André
Bouzinac
Albertvillanovadelmoral
Jsamwrites
Baidax
LearnKnowGive1
Mathieu Kappler
Daieuxetdailleurs
Archives nationales DJI
Jmax
LearnKnowGive1
  Notified participants of WikiProject France. 92.184.104.112 09:01, 12 May 2022 (UTC)

  Support Pamputt (talk) 18:16, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

CPRF person IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionперсональная страница члена Коммунистической партии Российской Федерации (ru) – (Please translate this into English.)
RepresentsCommunist Party of the Russian Federation (Q192187)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Example 1Gennady Zyuganov (Q182452)zyuganov
Example 2Vladimir Kashin (Q4218103)kashin
Example 3Valery Rashkin (Q4391353)rashkin
Sourcehttps://kprf.ru
External linksUse in sister projects: [ar][de][en][es][fr][he][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Planned usefor usage in stated in (P248) and for Template:Authority control (Q3907614)
Number of IDs in sourceunknown
Expected completenesseventually complete (Q21873974)
Formatter URLhttps://kprf.ru/personal/$1
Robot and gadget jobsMix'x'match
See alsoUnited Russia member ID (P10494)
Applicable "stated in"-valueCommunist Party of the Russian Federation (Q192187)
Single-value constraintyes
Distinct-values constraintyes
Wikidata projectRussia

MotivationEdit

КПРФ является одной из ведущих оппозиционных политических партий России. Она постоянно занимает вторые места на выборах не только в Государственную думу, но и региональные парламенты. Известные её члены выступают авторами различных законопроектов и играют важную роль в российской политике. MasterRus21thCentury (talk) 06:51, 21 May 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

<span id="Person identifier of Ozon (Q2365235)">Person identifier of Ozon (Q2365235)Edit

   Under discussion
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainpersons, mainly writers and musicians
Allowed valuesnumbers
Example 1Candi Staton (Q449200)2485566
Example 2Mark Twain (Q7245)243745
Example 3Louis Armstrong (Q1779)293766
Formatter URLhttps://www.ozon.ru/person/$1

MotivationEdit

Ozon.ru is the leading online market for books and music in Russia. eugrus (talk) 22:07, 29 May 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

FirstCycling (riderID)Edit

   Ready Create
DescriptionID of riders in First Cycling-Database
Data typeExternal identifier
Template parameterde:Vorlage:FirstCycling (riderID)
Domainitem
Allowed values[0-9]+
Example 1Vincenzo Nibali (Q312322)133
Example 2Jaroslav Kvapil (Q105580936)21998
Example 3Willy De Geest (Q2352408)3721
Formatter URLhttps://firstcycling.com/rider.php?r=$1
See alsoProperty:P1409, Property:P1663
Single-value constraintyes
Distinct-values constraintyes

MotivationEdit

Request by User:Lutz Jödicke (see this edit) --M2k~dewiki (talk) 10:03, 2 June 2022 (UTC)

Similar to

DiscussionEdit

  •   Support --Trade (talk) 21:20, 2 June 2022 (UTC)

Broadway World person IDEdit

   Ready Create
Descriptionidentifier for a person or organization on the Broadway World website
RepresentsBroadway World (Q60743360)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainitem; human (Q5) and organization (Q43229)
Allowed units[A-Za-z\-]+
Example 1John Clancy (Q112426359)John-Clancy
Example 2Jeanine Tesori (Q16194364)Jeanine-Tesori
Example 3Colleen Dewhurst (Q253916)Colleen-Dewhurst and Coleen-Dewhurst
Example 4David Mamet (Q269927)David-Mamet
Example 5Christopher Ashley (Q5111868)Christopher-Ashley
Example 6Toni-Leslie James (Q7821230)Toni-Leslie-James
Example 7Junkyard Dog Productions (Q112429406)Junkyard-Dog-Productions
Sourcehttps://www.broadwayworld.com/people/
Planned useadding to existing items and newly created items
Expected completenessalways incomplete (Q21873886)
Formatter URLhttps://www.broadwayworld.com/people/$1/
See alsoInternet Broadway Database person ID (P1220), Internet Off-Broadway Database ID (P4456), Playbill person ID (P6132), Broadway Photographs person ID (P7467)
Applicable "stated in"-valueBroadway World (Q60743360)

MotivationEdit

Broadway World (Q60743360) is a theater news website, with biographies of persons associated with the Broadway theater and elsewhere. Persons in the database include actors, directors, producers, playwrights, composers, orchestrators, lighting designers, set designers, costume designers, choreographers, etc. Entries for persons include biographical information, news, stage credits, and photographs. While in most cases there will only be a single ID for a person, there are some examples of multiple IDs, as shown in the third example. These can be exceptions to the single-value constraint. The site also includes production companies and other corporate bodies related to the theater. UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 18:27, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  Support --Crystal Clements, University of Washington Libraries (talk) 00:30, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Sheilatb (talk) 13:54, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Emwille (talk) 14:04, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Sandrileine (talk) 01:45, 17 June 2022 (UTC)

Yamaha Artists IDEdit

   Ready Create
Descriptionidentifier for a musician or musical ensemble on the Yamaha Artists website
RepresentsYamaha Artists (Q112430569)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainitem; human (Q5) and musical ensemble (Q2088357)
Allowed values[a-zA-Z0-9\.]+
Example 1John Clancy (Q112426359)johnclancy
Example 2Burt Bacharach (Q212762)burtbacharach
Example 3Jennifer Gookin Cavanaugh (Q107365170)jennifercavanaugh
Example 4Boston Brass (Q112431169)bostonbrass
Example 5F. Gerard Errante (Q112432953)f.gerarderrante
Example 6Logic (Q6667429)logic
Example 72Cellos (Q222015)2CELLOS
Sourcehttps://www.yamaha.com/artists/categories.html?CTID=5070000
Planned useadding to existing or newly created items
Expected completenessalways incomplete (Q21873886)
Formatter URLhttps://www.yamaha.com/artists/$1.html
Applicable "stated in"-valueYamaha Artists (Q112430569)

MotivationEdit

Yamaha Artists (Q112430569) contains biographical information on musicians who perform on Yamaha instruments, including photographs, list of the gear they use, links to tour information and links to the artists' websites. UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 19:50, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  Support --Crystal Clements, University of Washington Libraries (talk) 00:30, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Emwille (talk) 14:32, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Sandrileine (talk) 01:45, 17 June 2022 (UTC)

Theatrical Index person IDEdit

   Ready Create
Descriptionidentifier for a person listed in Theatrical Index
RepresentsTheatrical Index (Q112529689)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainitem; human (Q5)
Allowed values[a-z\-]+
Example 1David Holcenberg (Q112527698)david-holcenberg
Example 2Lucy Liu (Q188375)lucy-liu
Example 3Chita Rivera (Q450918)chita-rivera
Example 4Guy Oliver-Watts (Q41692335)guy-oliver-watts
Example 5Randy Rainbow (Q7292384)randy-rainbow
Example 6John Waters (Q363876)john-waters-ii
Example 7David Mamet (Q269927)david-mamet
Example 8Michael R. Jackson (Q66622353)michael-r-jackson
Sourcehttps://www.theatricalindex.com/
Planned useadding to newly created or existing items
Expected completenessalways incomplete (Q21873886)
Formatter URLhttps://www.theatricalindex.com/person/$1
See alsoPlaybill person ID (P6132), Internet Broadway Database person ID (P1220), Internet Off-Broadway Database ID (P4456), Theatricalia person ID (P2469)
Applicable "stated in"-valueTheatrical Index (Q112529689)

MotivationEdit

Theatrical Index (Q112529689) "has been the comprehensive resource for theatre professionals for over 40 years. It's an accurate, factual and up-to-date listing of all the shows on Broadway, Off-Broadway, Touring Productions, and the Premieres across the country." The site includes information on actors, playwrights, producers, composers, orchestrators, directors, and other persons associated with theatre in the U.S. Listings include photographs and the productions that a person has been associated with, with links to the Theatrical Index page for the productions. UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 20:15, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  Support --Crystal Clements, University of Washington Libraries (talk) 00:30, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Emwille (talk) 14:04, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Sheilatb (talk) 14:05, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Sandrileine (talk) 01:46, 17 June 2022 (UTC)

ClimateCultures Directory IDEdit

   Ready Create
Descriptionidentifier for a person in the ClimateCultures Directory
RepresentsClimateCultures Directory (Q112584250)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainitem; human (Q5)
Allowed values[1-9][0-9]*
Example 1Mark Goldthorpe (Q112585354)2380
Example 2Eva Strautmann (Q1230142)13507
Example 3Brit Griffin (Q4969162)5320
Example 4Bill McGuire (Q4910120)11391
Sourcehttps://climatecultures.net/members-directory/
Planned usewill add to items being created or existing items being edited
Number of IDs in sourceover 200
Expected completenessalways incomplete (Q21873886)
Formatter URLhttps://climatecultures.net/members-directory/$1/
Applicable "stated in"-valueClimateCultures Directory (Q112584250)

MotivationEdit

ClimateCultures Directory (Q112584250) is a list of the members of ClimateCultures – Creative Conversations for the Anthropocene (Q112584609), "an online space for creative minds to share responses to our ecological and climate predicaments. It's a network of artists, curators and researchers working across many practices, venues and disciplines." Each entry in the directory includes a biographical sketch written by the person, a photograph, metadata tags to use to find other similar individuals, and links to the person's website and social media sites. UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 23:02, 15 June 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  Support --Crystal Clements, University of Washington Libraries (talk) 00:30, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

  Support --Emwille (talk) 14:02, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

Copains d'avant IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionidentifier for a person on Copains d'avant
RepresentsCopains d'avant (Q2996720)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Example 1Marianne Maximi (Q112635593)10260540
Example 2Alice Garrigoux (Q28723376)5054751
Example 3Thierry Caro (Q55468017)1831245
Formatter URLhttps://copainsdavant.linternaute.com/p/wd-$1

VIGNERON
Mathieudu68
Ayack
Benoît Prieur
Ash Crow
Tubezlob
PAC2
Thierry Caro
Pymouss
Alphos
Nomen ad hoc
GAllegre
Jean-Frédéric
Manu1400
Thibdx
Marianne Casamance
NTranchant
Nattes à chat
Pierre André
Bouzinac
Albertvillanovadelmoral
Jsamwrites
Baidax
LearnKnowGive1
Mathieu Kappler
Daieuxetdailleurs
Archives nationales DJI
Jmax
LearnKnowGive1
  Notified participants of WikiProject France. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 21:13, 20 June 2022 (UTC).

  • Plutôt contre, je suis pas sûr...(je peux élaborer si besoin). --Benoît (discussion) 21:22, 20 June 2022 (UTC)
    Volontiers Benoît   ; je n'ai pas d'a priori sur ce site. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 09:13, 21 June 2022 (UTC).
    Je trouve que ça n'apporte rien de consistant quant au sujet qui rend admissible les personnes concernées sur Wikidata, si ce n'est une incursion dans la vie privée que je trouve un peu gênante. --Benoît (discussion) 09:16, 21 June 2022 (UTC) Et puis on va tout de même pas sourcer le parcours scolaire et professionnel avec Copains d'Avant. Le premier exemple, Alice Garrigoux, est supposée être toujours vivante en 2022 (104 ans...). Enfin, on a aucune assurance que la personne qui a créé le compte est bien la personne considérée. Donc globalement, pour toutes ces raisons, je suis plutôt contre. --Benoît (discussion) 09:24, 21 June 2022 (UTC)
    Ok, merci. Après c'est pareil pour beaucoup d'autres RS, Nomen ad hoc (talk) 09:30, 21 June 2022 (UTC).
  •   Support, même si ça a l'air de vivoter depuis une bonne décennie. Thierry Caro (talk) 23:33, 20 June 2022 (UTC)
  •   Oppose quand bien même le site ne serait pas en déclin depuis presque dix ans, je vois mal ce qu'apporte ce site à Wikidata. Si le lien s'avère vraiment nécessaire la propriété générale website account on (P553) suffit largement pour répondre au besoin, eg. Q110943416#P553. Cdlt, VIGNERON (talk) 19:27, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

IRFA IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionidentifier for a French Catholic missionary on the IRFA website
RepresentsFrance-Asia Research Institute (Q98969262)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Example 1Jean-Baptiste Etcharren (Q73466415)4061
Example 2Yves Ramousse (Q2602273)3965
Example 3Jean L'Hour (Q87400516)4053
Formatter URLhttps://irfa.paris/missionnaire/$1
Single-value constraintyes
Distinct-values constraintyes

VIGNERON
Mathieudu68
Ayack
Benoît Prieur
Ash Crow
Tubezlob
PAC2
Thierry Caro
Pymouss
Alphos
Nomen ad hoc
GAllegre
Jean-Frédéric
Manu1400
Thibdx
Marianne Casamance
NTranchant
Nattes à chat
Pierre André
Bouzinac
Albertvillanovadelmoral
Jsamwrites
Baidax
LearnKnowGive1
Mathieu Kappler
Daieuxetdailleurs
Archives nationales DJI
Jmax
LearnKnowGive1
  Notified participants of WikiProject France. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 12:57, 23 June 2022 (UTC).

Adequat Agency person IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionidentifier for a person on Adequat Agency website
RepresentsAdequat artists (Q112678927)
Data typeExternal identifier
Template parameterexternal_links
Domainactor (Q33999), film director (Q2526255), theatrical director (Q3387717), screenwriter (Q28389), author (Q482980)
Allowed values_[1-9]\d{3,5}
Example 1Samir Boitard (Q14951218)_667395
Example 2Hélène Zimmer (Q19502649)_746234
Example 3Stefano Accorsi (Q433565)_157307
Sourcehttp://www.agence-adequat.com/liste.cfm
External linksUse in sister projects: [ar][de][en][es][fr][he][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Planned useas authority control and identifier: Wikidata property for authority control for artists (Q55653847)
Number of IDs in source988
Expected completenessalways incomplete (Q21873886)
Formatter URLhttp://www.agence-adequat.com/fiche.cfm/$1.html
CountryFrance (Q142)
See alsoDerrieux agency person ID (P10034)
Applicable "stated in"-valueAdequat artists (Q112678927)
Type constraint – instance ofhuman (Q5)
Single-value constraintyes
Distinct-values constraintyes
Wikidata projectWikiProject France (Q10816832) - {{France properties}}

MotivationEdit

Property for people included on the Adequat Agency's website, a database in French. - Coagulans (talk) 20:09, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

Full nameEdit

ProfessionEdit

WorkEdit