Wikidata:Property proposal/Sports

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See alsoEdit

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GeneralEdit

level of professionalnessEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionlevel of competition generally associated with this item
Data typeItem
Domainhuman (Q5), organization (Q43229), event (Q1656682), award (Q618779)
Allowed valuesprofessional, amateur, collegiate, semi-professional, pro–am, youth
Example 12019 NFL season (Q60526042) → professional
Example 2Duke Blue Devils men's basketball (Q4171772) → collegiate
Example 3USL League Two (Q976491) → amateur
Example 4AT&T Pebble Beach National Pro-Am (Q298589) → pro–am
Planned usefor classifying sports, competitions, awards, etc in a clear way
See alsocompetition class (P2094)

MotivationEdit

Right now, there doesn't seem to be a clear consistent way to classify whether a team/league/event/etc is pro, amateur, or whatever else. I deal with a lot of college sports items, and I've noticed that there's no consistent way to distinguish collegiate teams. Sometimes it gets set in the sport (P641) field (e.g. college basketball (Q48890) instead of or in addition to basketball (Q5372)), sometimes it gets set in instance of (P31) (e.g. college sports team (Q18558301), NCAA Division I women's basketball team (Q54190181)), sometimes you could follow the parent club (P831) property and find a university and college sports club (Q2367225) instance (not ideal since that's another item lookup), and sometimes there's no clear indication at all. This seems like a really basic fact that ought to be easy to determine for any sports-related item (in the same way that sport (P641) and competition class (P2094) are).

For the 6 allowed values I picked (pro/amateur/collegiate/semi-pro/pro-am/youth), my assumption is that we'd create new items for most/all of them. There are existing items that kind of work (professional (Q702269), amateur (Q455595), college sports (Q5146583), semi-professional sports (Q4371047), pro–am (Q7252932), youth sports (Q599867)). However, some of these are sports-specific, and I'd like to see this property also being used for awards/competitions/etc outside the realm of sports.

The 6 values I picked are definitely up for debate. I think this property should be limited to a fairly short list of allowed values so that it's not cumbersome to use (we have competition class (P2094) for expressing greater complexity), but exactly what's on that list may need to be tweaked. IagoQnsi (talk) 00:49, 23 September 2020 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Support This sounds good to me. Some other values that would make sense are "middle school," "high school," "inter-mural collegiate." Maybe "pick-up" too, but I can't think of a case where that would be used. Regarding the label, "level of professionalness" is quite clunky, but I also don't have a better a better suggestion. — The Erinaceous One 🦔 05:50, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
    • @The-erinaceous-one: In the interest of keeping the list of values for this property as short as possible, I'd lean towards not adding those values. Middle/high school would fit under "youth", and intramural collegiate fits under "amateur". My concept for this property is to be extremely general, in the same vein as manner of death (P1196). More precise classifications can be accomplished with competition class (P2094). –IagoQnsi (talk) 16:38, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
  •   Oppose; this is exactly the same problem that we are solving with competition class (P2094) (eligibility criteria to enter an event as a participant), and I think we should use that property to cover this aspect as well. I would not require and re-definition of competition class (P2094); a few new value items are sufficient actually. —MisterSynergy (talk) 09:09, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
    • @MisterSynergy: We definitely could use competition class (P2094) for this, true. The reason I wanted a new property, however, is that competition class (P2094) is a somewhat complex property that allows a wide range of values, which makes it harder to do simple queries with. If you're trying to do a query for items related to collegiate sports in general (i.e. not any particular sport), for example, you'd have to either need to use a hardcoded list of all the college sports (e.g. college basketball (Q48890), college football (Q1109032), college sports (Q5146583)), or your query would have to retrieve the value item of the competition class (P2094) claim to check if it's a college sport, which is more complex and expensive. Having a separate property with a very limited set of values makes retrieval easier. –IagoQnsi (talk) 16:15, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
      • Querying with competition class (P2094) is actually pretty efficient, as it is a transitive property. This means that you neither need a hardcoded list in the query, nor do you need to make complex restrictions regarding the values of P2094 to use it.
        Experience shows that the proposed property will probably not be used with "a very limited set of values" even if this is the initial intention; also that edit count hunters will likely pour it to a large amount of items even if it does not fit at all (happened with P2094 as well); and that data users will not know whether to use P2094 or this one or both. Having a second "competing" property for a very similar purpose like an existing one is usually a bad idea here. —MisterSynergy (talk) 17:09, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
        • @MisterSynergy: Having manner of death (P1196) and cause of death (P509) seems to work okay. Much like P1196, I'm imagining this property having a one-of constraint limiting the possible values. If the constraint is widely ignored, we could have a bot enforce it by removing invalid entries. –IagoQnsi (talk) 16:38, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
          • Removing "invalid entries" is an extremely tedious task and quite quickly you run into conflicts if you do so. I’d rather not rely on this option. —MisterSynergy (talk) 19:36, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
  • On second thought: Perhaps "pro-am" should be eliminated, and pro-am events should instead be classed as both "professional" and "amateur". Otherwise we might end up seeing more and more values created to specify every possible combination of the existing values. And maybe "semi-pro" should go too – it's really just a subclass of "pro". –IagoQnsi (talk) 16:43, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
    • Well, "youth" does not fit here either as it is already a facet of the P2094 values, leaving "professional" and "amateur". —MisterSynergy (talk) 19:36, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
      • @MisterSynergy: The idea is that every item which has P2094 should also be able to be classified under this new property (much like how every item with "cause of death" can also have "manner of death"). P2094 is where the detailed descriptor can go (i.e. "U-16 association football" or "middle school golf" or whatever), whereas this new property contains the broad category ("youth"). The goal is to enable more general queries. If you want to filter a query to only professional sports, for example, you have to dig deep into every P2094 object to figure out whether or not that item is a professional class or not. This property would make such queries much more feasible. –IagoQnsi (talk) 12:57, 20 October 2020 (UTC)
        • This is clearly not a good idea. Actually, for most sport events the "level of professionalness" is no factor at all; athletes can compete regardless of their status. It appears to me that this sort of distinction is made in the US and a few other countries, but by far not everywhere in the world. It is certainly a bad idea to add it to anything that has already a P2094 if it is not a factor in most cases.
          Besides that, you can already now query for something like "only professional sports" easily. Since professionalness is not yet incorporated in P2094, I use under-23 sport (Q14510042) here to demonstrate it: a query as simple as SELECT ?item WHERE { ?item wdt:P2094* wd:Q14510042 } lists you all items that have a competition class item with the Under-23 age class facet---obviously with no deep digging required. Once again, P2094 is a transitive property for exactly that reason, and adding the professionalness to it is really simple. ---MisterSynergy (talk) 13:22, 20 October 2020 (UTC)
  •   Oppose As per the above discussion, I am in favor of building ou competition class (P2094) rather than having a very similar property. --Mad melone (talk) 11:21, 26 October 2020 (UTC)

represented in sport byEdit

MotivationEdit

The existing "represented by" property seems to focus on talent agents and such, and wouldn't seem to include relationships like the examples I've listed. That said, perhaps that property's scope could be expanded. I have no strong feelings either way; I just want to establish a clear way to represent this type of relationship. IagoQnsi (talk) 19:48, 25 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  • I think a property in the inverse direction would be preferable, i.e. something like United States Soccer Federation (Q222131) <represents> United States of America (Q30). The country items are already overloaded with plenty of things, and this sort of information is more important to the organizations than to the countries. I think currently country (P17) is being used instead of <represents>, but that is clearly not ideal either. At this point I am not sure whether I would support an approach inverse to this proposal, but I'm going to watch how this develops. —MisterSynergy (talk) 20:09, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
  •   Comment It could be interesting to have some sort of way to provide a geographic breakdown for organizations. Similar to youth wing (P4379). --- Jura 17:10, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
  •   Oppose I agree with MisterSynergy this would be better in the reverse direction; however the reverse relations already exist on the examples (either country (P17) or owned by (P127)) so I don't think a property for this is needed at all. ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:53, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
  •   Oppose per Arthur. Mahir256 (talk) 20:51, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
  •   Oppose Agree with previous comments. Amadalvarez (talk) 21:08, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

Sports equipmentEdit

Sports venueEdit

Sports teamEdit

ESPN.com men's college basketball team IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionidentifier for an NCAA Division I men's basketball team on ESPN.com
RepresentsESPN.com (Q3046137)
Data typeExternal identifier
Allowed values[1-9]\d*
Example 1Duke Blue Devils men's basketball (Q4171772)150
Example 2UCLA Bruins men's basketball (Q3615392)26
Example 3Kansas Jayhawks men's basketball (Q6365002)2305
Sourcehttps://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/teams
Planned useProvides external links to a noted sports news website
Number of IDs in sourcea few hundred
Expected completenesseventually complete (Q21873974)
Formatter URLhttps://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/team/_/id/$1
See alsoSports-Reference.com college basketball school ID (P8825), ESPN.com NBA player ID (P3685)

MotivationEdit

Allows us to link basketball teams to ESPN.com for schedules, stats, rosters, etc. IagoQnsi (talk) 17:15, 15 November 2020 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

Sporting eventEdit

Number of tries markedEdit

   Under discussion
DescriptionNumber of tries marked during a competition of rugby
Data typenombre entier-invalid datatype (not in Module:i18n/datatype)
Template parameter« nombre d'assaigs » dans -->
Allowed valuesnombre entier
Allowed unitsnombres entiers
Example 12020–21 Rugby Pro D2 season (Q98476124)
Example 22020–21 Top 14 season (Q97495124)
Example 32019–20 Premiership Rugby (Q64521002)
Source
Planned useUsage hebdomadaire

MotivationEdit

Les championnats de rugby, toutes compéticions confondues, prennent en compte le nombre de points marqués, (propriété P1351), et aussi d'essais. Il serait intéressant de prévoir une telle propriété afin d'enrichir la base de donnée.

Dans un premier temps, je soumets à votre avis cette proposition qui correspondant au nombre d'essais marqués au cours de la compétition en question.

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:18, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

two-pointers madeEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of two-point field goals scored by a basketball player
Representstwo-point field goal (Q104661416)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / two-pointers made  4
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / two-pointers made  8
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / two-pointers made  1
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 16:07, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:20, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

two-pointers attemptedEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of two-point field goals attempted by a basketball player
Representstwo-point field goal (Q104661416)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / two-pointers attempted  7
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / two-pointers attempted  11
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / two-pointers attempted  1
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 16:08, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:19, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

three-pointers madeEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of three-point field goals scored by a basketball player
Representsthree-point field goal (Q746826)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / three-pointers made  2
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / three-pointers made  0
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / three-pointers made  0
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 16:11, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:19, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

three-pointers attemptedEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of three-point field goals attempted by a basketball player
Representsthree-point field goal (Q746826)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / three-pointers attempted  6
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / three-pointers attempted  0
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / three-pointers attempted  0
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 16:10, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:19, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

free throws madeEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of free throws scored by a basketball player
Representsfree throw (Q1191341)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / free throws made  1
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / free throws made  5
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / free throws made  0
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 16:32, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:18, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

free throws attemptedEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of free throws attempted by a basketball player
Representsfree throw (Q1191341)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / free throws attempted  2
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / free throws attempted  6
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / free throws attempted  0
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 16:32, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:17, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

field goals madeEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of field goals made by a basketball player
Representsfield goal (Q3991740)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / field goals made  6
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / field goals made  8
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / field goals made  1
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 16:40, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:17, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

personal foulsEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of personal fouls committed by a basketball player
Representspersonal foul (Q15073191)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / personal fouls  2
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / personal fouls  3
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / personal fouls  0
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 17:14, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:16, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

offensive reboundsEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of rebounds performed on offense by a basketball player
Representsrebound (Q654355)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / offensive rebounds  1
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / offensive rebounds  7
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / offensive rebounds  0
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 20:21, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:19, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

defensive reboundsEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of rebounds performed on defense by a basketball player
Representsrebound (Q654355)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / defensive rebounds  1
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / defensive rebounds  6
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / defensive rebounds  0
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 20:22, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:16, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

total reboundsEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionnumber of rebounds performed by a basketball player
Representsrebound (Q654355)
Data typeQuantity
Allowed valuesnon-negative integers
Example 11989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Bob Scrabis (Q98841453) / total rebounds  2
Example 21989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Alonzo Mourning (Q310968) / total rebounds  13
Example 31989 Georgetown vs. Princeton men's basketball game (Q90747291) participant (P710) Sam Jefferson (Q98849016) / total rebounds  0
Planned useQualifier to use for box scores of basketball games

MotivationEdit

A commonly tracked statistic in basketball box scores. IagoQnsi (talk) 20:19, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.
I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
  • Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).
  • Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder
I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks Amadalvarez (talk) 20:19, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Number of conferencesEdit

   Under discussion
DescriptionNumber of seasons in which the league is split
Data typeQuantity
Domainsports league (Q623109), sports season (Q27020041)
Allowed valuespositive integers
Example 1Q209738 → 2
Example 2Segunda División B (Q751826) → 4
Example 3National Basketball Association (Q155223) → 2
Planned useUse of the property in objects of splitted leagues and their playing times.
Robot and gadget jobsno
Wikidata projectWikiProject Sports

MotivationEdit

So far there was no way to mark that a league is splittet into several seasons. This is also due to the fact that there is currently no separate object for the German word “Staffel” and its meaning. For this reason, for example, the following statement cannot be used alternatively in the object 2020–21 2. Frauen-Bundesliga (Q96370686):

has part (P527)
  Staffel
quantity 2
0 references
add reference


add value

With the proposed property, one could elegantly avoid the aforementioned detour. But I have to admit that with the English name of the property I am not entirely sure whether I have chosen the correct name. Therefore you can correct me there if you have a better name. I also want to mention that in German there could be a mix-up between the proposed property and the property Anzahl Staffeln (P2437), which indicates the number of seasons in a television series. --Gymnicus (talk) 21:12, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

strikeoutsEdit

MotivationEdit

Other basic baseball statistics are being created in Wikidata such as number of at bats (P9180), number of hits (P9184) and bases on balls (P9188). Strikeout total is another fundamental statistic that can be recorded for both pitchers and batters as well as for games and tournaments. UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 16:48, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  • I'm not so sure that having a shared property for strikeouts pitched and strikeouts batted will work very well. Pitchers can also bat, so we'd have to have two participant (P710) statements for every pitcher on every baseball game. --IagoQnsi (talk) 00:06, 24 February 2021 (UTC)
  • If two separate properties were created, you'd still need two statements, so it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other. But I can turn this into two separate properties if that's the consensus of the community. UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 00:10, 24 February 2021 (UTC)

earned run averageEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionearned run average of a baseball pitcher in a career or season
Representsearned run average (Q1145091)
Data typeQuantity
Domainitem; pitcher (Q1048902)
Example 1Tom Seaver (Q1287084) → 2.86
Example 2Tug McGraw (Q2459273) → 3.14
Example 3Lefty Grove (Q751263) → 3.06
Example 4Babe Ruth (Q213812) → 2.28
Sourcehttps://www.baseball-reference.com/
Planned useadding to pitcher items
Expected completenessalways incomplete (Q21873886)

MotivationEdit

This is another fundamental baseball statistic that it would be good to be able to record in items for pitchers. UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 20:07, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

Sports organizationEdit

Olympedia Affiliation IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionidentifier for the affilitation of an athlete at www.olympedia.org
RepresentsOlympedia athlete database (Q95606922)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainorganization (Q43229)
Allowed values[1-9]\d{0,5}
Example 1Q17282176324
Example 2Waseda University (Q274486)999
Example 3Industriales (Q1661948)12047
Number of IDs in source>15200
Expected completenesseventually complete (Q21873974)
Formatter URLhttps://www.olympedia.org/affiliations/$1

MotivationEdit

Deutsch: Wir haben bereits alle möglichen Kennungen für olympische Athleten. Aber zusammen mit den Athleten sind bei vielen auch Zugehörigkeiten zu Clubs oder Universitäten dokumentiert, hier am Beispiel von Olympedia.org. Es macht Sinn, dass wir diese Zugehörigkeiten auch mit den entsprechenden Items verlinken. Fundriver (talk) 10:31, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
English: We already have all possible olympic athletes ID. But together with them also affiliations to sport-clubs, universities and so on are documented in the olympic-databases, here on the example of Olympedia.org. It makes sense to also link those affiliations to the correspondending items. Fundriver (talk) 10:31, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Support Fundriver (talk) 10:44, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
  •   Support; we also need one for Olympedia results and Olympedia delegations… —MisterSynergy (talk) 10:50, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
  •   Support --Deansfa (talk) 22:24, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
  • Question: @Fundriver: What is the intended outcome here? It would be useful to use this dataset to map athlete <--> institution affiliations using pre-existing properties such as member of sports team (P54) than store that data in dedicated Olympedia database properties. I am happy for institution IDs to be mapped on to the institution items, then cross-reference to populate the relevant club/university on athlete items via existing properties. Is that the intention? Sillyfolkboy (talk) 22:58, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
I don't totally understand? The Affiliation-ID belongs to the institution - which is supposed to be created here? For sure those affiliations also indicate our member of sports team (P54)-relation we have here and would be nice, if this could be mapped somehow automated. However, to have this ID also as property to have a reference of Olympia-participants of certain sportclub is useful. Fundriver (talk) 06:19, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
  Support Cool - that answers my question about usage so all good from me :) Sillyfolkboy (talk) 01:16, 2 January 2021 (UTC)
  •   Support --Edgars2007 (talk) 13:35, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
  •   Support --Sannita - not just another it.wiki sysop 21:20, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
  •   Support --Phikia (talk) 02:06, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
  •   Support --Migrant (talk) 15:28, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
  •   Comment -- Note that the listed affiliations at the athlete-pages are the affilitions they were under during their olympic participation, which means that they are not always complete for the sports athletes career. Migrant (talk) 15:35, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
  •   Strong oppose @MisterSynergy, Fundriver:, Just like P9055 and P8286, "expected completeness" is completely wrong. All these properties take the value always incomplete (Q21873886). —Eihel (talk) 09:57, 28 January 2021 (UTC)
    Is this really meant to be opposition to the proposal? The "expected completeness" as given above should not matter for this, right? Aside from that, I still strongly disagree with your position, as "expected completeness" refers to the completeness of our mapping to external database entries, not the indefinite completeness of the external database itself. —MisterSynergy (talk) 23:36, 28 January 2021 (UTC)
    Dear MisterSynergy, I come back after careful consideration, because you raise several points and I wanted to respond you with hindsight and calm. I am really very surprised by your first sentence. I put here an aspect of the recommendations present since April 2020: All opposing points of discussion should be addressed before creation occurs. If there is still disagreement, it is up to the property creator to consider the thoughtfulness and logic behind points of discussion (i.e. an opposing voice with no thought behind it should not block creation, but a single reasonable opposing voice against many supporters may do so). Can an error be propagated in production? Why are there PCs? I wouldn't offend you on this first point.
    Through our discussions, here and on your TP, you should only use always incomplete (Q21873886) very little. But it's one of the most used values, it's surprising. The fact that you do not agree with me does not advance our case.
    I'm glad you used the term "mapping". Data mapping is used as the first step in data integration tasks. This process can be verified in numerous works, worthy of the name, dealing with this subject. If the mapping is designed or verified at a time t, the data integration is part of a duration aspect. The level of data integration by users is also the goal of P2429 ("set of real-world items").
    If the external db accepts new entries, the mapping becomes incomplete on the WD side. Athletes or sporting events become known only from new OGs (non-existent items). The mapping only exists from a link between WD and an external source, that is, a property and in the way you approach the subject, completeness is changing over time. No, almost not. Yes, "expected completeness" refers to the completeness of our mapping to external database entries, but this must be valid over time (data integration), therefore completely linked to the external database itself.
    In the past, an example has already been given: If a user asks for an ISBN that we don't have, there's a good chance it's a good ISBN that we don't cover - but if they're looking for a country code that we don't have, there's chances are it is an invalid code. Let's redo the process: if a user asks for an athlete ID that we don't have, there is no good chance that it is an invalid ID. So this deduction proves to you that it's always incomplete (Q21873886) that you have to put here and on the properties that I mentioned in my first intervention, as is ISBN-13 (P212). QED (will never be complete at any level).
    I do not intend to come back to this problem indefinitely: the proposition is false and prevents the creation of the property. Warmest regards. —Eihel (talk) 05:34, 7 February 2021 (UTC)
    @MisterSynergy: Okay, I notify you by correction, even though i haven't been. —Eihel (talk) 05:47, 7 February 2021 (UTC)

AthleteEdit

NFL.com IDEdit

   Under discussion
DescriptionThis is a property to replace the rotted NFL.com ID (former scheme) (P3539). Unfortunately this has not been handled well as people tried to either deprecate the rotted links (not correct) or repurpose the old property for the new format (also not correct).
Data typeExternal identifier
Template parameternflwd at en:Template:Infobox NFL player
DomainAmerican football players
Allowed values[a-z-]+\d?
Example 1Brian Schweda (Q24810030) → brian-schweda
Example 2Larry Allen (Q25464) → larry-allen
Example 3Warren Moon (Q126710) → warren-moon
Formatter URLhttps://www.nfl.com/players/$1
See alsoNFL.com ID (former scheme) (P3539)

MotivationEdit

The current situation is very bad. Some items have the old numeric ids. Some were incorrectly converted to the new format that would be used for this new property. And some are randomly deprecated. We should point the old property at an archive.org url and keep them undeprecated. Unravelling this mess won't be easy. Hopefully those involved in making it will help undo it. BrokenSegue (talk) 15:05, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

Pinging people involved here: @Ghuron: @ZVER18: @Dissident93: @Jura1:

DiscussionEdit

NCAA Statistics player IDEdit

MotivationEdit

Provides official college sports statistics for all sports and all divisions in the NCAA - Arturo63 (talk) 16:02, 31 October 2020 (UTC).

DiscussionEdit

  •   Oppose So, the strings you've specified don't appear to merely specify a player -- it appears to specify a particular player in a particular season of a particular sport at a particular university. The org_id matches the "NCAA school code" property proposal I've recently made, and the game_sport_year_ctl_id would appear to uniquely identify a season of a sport. The part that actually identifies a player is the stats_player_seq; however, there's no apparent way to link directly to a player across their whole career. If we add the property as specified, it will result in many duplicates (one for each season a player has played in). –IagoQnsi (talk) 00:50, 1 November 2020 (UTC)
  •   Strong oppose "expected completeness" is completely false (instead of Q21873886). —Eihel (talk) 10:01, 28 January 2021 (UTC)

Ligue 2 player IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionidentifier for a football player on the Ligue 2 website
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainassociation football player (Q937857)
Example 1Teddy Chevalier (Q154258)teddy-chevalier
Example 2Nicolas Pallois (Q957465)nicolas-pallois
Example 3Rémy Descamps (Q26262081)remy-descamps
Example 4Wissam Ben Yedder (Q137128)wissam-ben-yedder
Sourcehttps://www.ligue2.fr/listejoueurs
Planned useTemplate:Sports links (Q22674492)
Formatter URLhttps://www.ligue2.fr/joueur?id=$1

MotivationEdit

Delusion23
WFC
happy5214
Fawkesfr
Xaris333
A.Bernhard
Cekli829
Japan Football
HakanIST
Jmmuguerza
H4stings
Unnited meta
Grottem
Petro
Сидик из ПТУ
Sakhalinio
Gonta-Kun
CanadianCodhead
Laszaroh
Sherifkkvtm
  Notified participants of WikiProject Association football Since the revamping of the LFP website, LFP player ID (P3683) is not convenient for all Ligue 1/Ligue 2 players (see Property talk:P3683). Furthermore, the stats are not the same for Ligue 1 or Ligue 2...Rashinseita (talk) 10:49, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

Notable ascentEdit

   Under discussion
DescriptionDescription of important ascents made by a climber or a mountaineer
Data typeItem
Domainhuman (Q5)
Allowed valuescharacters ; mountain (Q8502) ; climbing route (Q1699583)
Example 1Alex Honnold (Q979249)El Capitan (Q1124852)
Example 2Lynn Hill (Q469872)The Nose (Q2413145)
Example 3Ueli Steck (Q676356)Eiger (Q4425)

MotivationEdit

Notable ascents are the equivalent of statistics in mountaineering and climbing. The idea behind this property is to link climbing routes and summits to major achievements of climber.
It is my first proposal. I don't know whether all relevant informations are here and whether everything is correct. I don't know where I can put expected qualifications as date, partner, time, style (solo, ...) in the proposal. Cheers Triboulet sur une montagne (talk) 22:27, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Comment It seems like this could be covered by significant place (P7153), though I can also see the value in having a separate property. Would this property include all known ascents or just a select few (and if the latter, what would be the criteria for inclusion)? --IagoQnsi (talk) 18:53, 12 January 2021 (UTC)

svoyak.info player IDEdit

   Ready Create
Descriptionidentifier for a player at the Base of Sport SI
Representsno label (Q105421789)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Example 1Anatoly Wasserman (Q1978432)276
Example 2Arkadii Liberman (Q96096374)86
Example 3Irina Tiurikova (Q28027684)780
Sourcehttps://svoyak.info/SI_players.php?
External linksUse in sister projects: [ar][de][en][es][fr][he][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Planned usefor usage in stated in (P248) and for Template:Authority control (Q3907614)
Expected completenesseventually complete (Q21873974)
Formatter URLhttps://svoyak.info/SI_player.php?player=$1
Robot and gadget jobsMaybe check captures in Internet Archive for just in case?
See also

MotivationEdit

Will be useful for stated in (P248), contains valuable statistical data. Сидик из ПТУ (talk) 11:34, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

  •   Support. —putnik 01:17, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
  •   Support, if name "svoyak" is some trade mark etc. for sports branch of this intellectual game.Carn (talk) 08:21, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
  •   Support, an important property for Sport SI.--Arbnos (talk) 11:38, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
  •   Support.--Erokhin (talk) 08:12, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

LFCHistory.net player IDEdit

Descriptionidentifier for football player on site LFCHistory.net
RepresentsLFChistory.net (Q21685219)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhuman (Q5)
Example 1Jean-Michel Ferri (Q2406997)300
Example 2Douglas Dick (Q5301412)600
Example 3Xabi Carita Alonso (Q208104)900
Example 4Thiago Alcântara (Q17493)1374
Sourcehttps://www.lfchistory.net
External linksUse in sister projects: [ar][de][en][es][fr][he][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Planned usefor usage in stated in (P248) and for Template:Authority control (Q3907614)
Expected completenesseventually complete (Q21873974)
Formatter URLhttps://www.lfchistory.net/Players/Player/Profile/$1
Robot and gadget jobsMaybe check captures in Internet Archive for just in case?
See alsoDynamoMania.com player ID (P7395), LevskiSofia.info player ID (P6411)

MotivationEdit

Valuable statistical data and other bio info by Liverpool F.C. (Q1130849) footballers. --Mitte27 (talk) 19:29, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit

CoachEdit

LFH player IDEdit

   Under discussion
Descriptionidentifier for staff on the website of the French Ligue féminine de handball
RepresentsLigue Féminine de Handball (Q3240590)
Data typeExternal identifier
Domainhandball coach (Q13365201)
Allowed values[^\s\/]+
Example
Sourcehttp://www.handlfh.org/staff/
External linksUse in sister projects: [ar][de][en][es][fr][he][it][ja][ko][nl][pl][pt][ru][sv][vi][zh][commons][species][wd].
Planned useTemplate:Sports links (Q22674492)
Formatter URLhttp://www.handlfh.org/staff/$1/
See alsoLFH player ID (P4289)

Motivering/begrunnelseEdit

Official database for coaches and other staff in Ligue Féminine de Handball (Q3240590). See also the equivalent player database: Wikidata:Property proposal/LFH ID. Theilert (talk) 23:50, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

DiscussionEdit