Wikidata:Property proposal/firing range

effective firing range edit

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Generic

Done: effective firing range (P4176) (Talk and documentation)

Description	distance within which a weapon can be used effectively
Data type	Number (not available yet)
Template parameter	`\|range=` in en:Template:Infobox Weapon
Domain	weapon
Allowed values	number
Allowed units	metre (Q11573), kilometre (Q828224)
Example	QJY-88 (Q6458018) → 1000m
Robot and gadget jobs	probably

Motivation

(Add your motivation for this property here.) GZWDer (talk) 09:14, 17 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion

Comment "firing range" is often the term used to describe a place where one can fire guns at targets. I think "weapon range" or perhaps "deadly range" would be a better name for this property. ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:22, 17 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
- See en:Shooting range for use of the term, for example. ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:23, 17 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Support with a better name, per Arthur. Added "kilometre" as an allowed unit, for artillery. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 21:25, 17 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose in the current form because the range of a weapon has many variable factors including the ammunition type, test conditions (weather, firing position), etc. For example, how would someone determine the range of a boomerang (Q131536)? I thought about whether determination method (P459) could be a mandatory qualifier to determine how the range was calculated, but am not aware of standards which may be used to test the range of weapons. Are there standards which could be referred to with a determination method (P459) property? If so, I'd be happy to change this vote to one of support as a testing standard should remove the variable factors. Dhx1 (talk) 12:23, 8 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Support Changed vote to one of support after reading the discussion below. Dhx1 (talk) 13:35, 30 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose As Dhx1. Weapon range is depending on several parameters and an interval should be used instead. Snipre (talk) 21:00, 22 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
- Question @Snipre:, can you clarify? Specifically, any idea on how such an interval idea would be implemented? Josh Baumgartner (talk) 09:38, 19 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  - @Joshbaumgartner: You have several types of ammunition which can be used on one weapon, so the first as explained above is to provide the ammunition type tested to define the range using determination method (P459). The best is to modify the scope of the property and to put not the firing range but the maximal lethal distance. I am not a spacialist so the best is to ask to people working in the weapon domain to provide the correct definition. Snipre (talk) 05:50, 21 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Support Knowing the effective range a weapon can be used to is very valuable. There may be many factors that go into determining what that range is for a particular weapon, but they are not always published. When they are available, of course qualifiers should be added. However, the fact that they are not always available is not a valid reason to not have a way to add the very important and pertinent information. If we don't have a property such as this, how do we capture the data in WD from a source that says, "the effective firing range of the 65 mm L/17 Cannon Model 13 (Q162404) is 6.8 km"? Josh Baumgartner (talk) 09:18, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Support (with a better name, perhaps "effective range" or "maximum effective range") per Joshbaumgartner. Thryduulf (talk) 21:53, 18 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Support--Micru (talk) 07:54, 24 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
"effective range" and "maximum range" are two different things: for handguns the latter can easily be two or three (or more) times as much as the former. I would like to see two separate properties. (I agree that "firing range" is a place where guns are fired: maybe "effective range of gun"?). - Brya (talk) 15:59, 7 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@Brya, Thryduulf, Joshbaumgartner, Snipre, Dhx1, ArthurPSmith: I renamed the property to "effective firing range". I prefer it over "effective range of gun" as it's likely also applicable to bows and similar range weapons. The wording matching the wording in the en-infobox. Can someone who has more domain knowledge write a good description? Otherwise, are there problems with creating the property under the name "effective range"? ChristianKl (talk) 12:35, 1 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
- "effective range" or "effective firing range"? I think "effective range" is actually the better label, I'd support it with that label. ArthurPSmith (talk) 14:26, 3 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  - I am fine with either label. In actual use, it can be honed if need be. Josh Baumgartner (talk) 17:03, 3 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Support usefull for description of cannons and artillery --Pmt (talk) 22:36, 1 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Weak support to get estimate in kilometers or 100m. Should be replaced with more exact information if available over time. d1g (talk) 21:21, 31 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@D1gggg, Pmt, Thryduulf, Dhx1, Pigsonthewing, Snipre: Can more of you add your opinions about which name you prefer? ChristianKl (talk) 08:54, 4 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]
- My preference is "effective range". Thryduulf (talk) 15:06, 4 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  - I do prefer effective firing range Breg Pmt (talk) 22:50, 5 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@GZWDer, Pigsonthewing, Dhx1, Joshbaumgartner, Thryduulf: @Snipre, Micru, Brya, ChristianKl, Pmt, D1gggg: Done ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:36, 24 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]