Wikidata:Property proposal/identity of subject in relation to statement

identity of subject in context

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Generic

   Done: identity of subject in context (P4649) (Talk and documentation)

Description	(qualifier) For subjects which may have different identities which are covered by different items, the identity to which the qualified statement applies
Data type	Item
Example	Eleventh Air Force (Q2387066)official name (P1448)Alaskan Air Commandidentity of subject in relation to statementAlaskan Air Command (Q4708663) Yentl Schieman (Q19361371)award received (P166)Annie M.G. Schmidt Prize (Q2433511)identity of subject in relation to statementYentl en de Boer (Q17429607) Italian Navy (Q833040)inception (P571)1861-01-01identity of subject in relation to statementRoyal Italian Navy (Q855186) Taiwan (Q865)member of (P463)Western and Central Pacific Fisheries Commission (Q2565027)identity of subject in relation to statementChinese Taipei (Q216923)
Planned use	All statements using P794 (P794) for this relation will be migrated
See also	subject has role (P2868)

Motivation

This relation is currently being expressed as a minority use case of P794 (P794), which is currently being deprecated because of its ambiguity. Swpb (talk) 14:17, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Discussion

• @Swpb: Can you clarify the difference between this proposal and subject has role (P2868) ?  – The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jheald (talk • contribs).
  • Yes – the identity of the subject in relation to a statement cannot always reasonably be called a "role". For instance, Royal Italian Navy (Q855186) is a former identity of Italian Navy (Q833040), not a role thereof. When Yzma (Q1143257) is a house cat (Q146), that is her identity, not a role/purpose/function that she plays. This could arguably be met by adding an alias to subject has role (P2868), but that could result in confusion, given that property's main description. The same could be said for applies to part (P518), which has also been suggested as a replacement for this use case. We could amend the main description of one of those properties perhaps. Swpb (talk) 14:54, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
•  Support though I'm hoping there's a shorter English label that would fit here (but not as!) ArthurPSmith (talk) 17:13, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
•  Support as the person who coined the idea of a separate "identity of subject in relation to statement"! Deryck Chan (talk) 22:43, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
  • I think the short name of this property should be "identity of subject".
    • I'm just worried that would allow confusion with instance of (P31), official name (P1448) and other non-qualifier properties. Maybe "in context of" instead of "in relation to"? Swpb (talk) 15:53, 30 November 2017 (UTC)
      • I don't think we should worry about confusion with non-qualifier properties, because subject has role (P2868) doesn't seem to have this problem. Deryck Chan (talk) 16:19, 30 November 2017 (UTC)
  • I see the difference between this proposed property and subject has role (P2868) and applies to part (P518) as:
    • If the subject of the statement is an instance of (P31) of the target of the qualifier in the context of the statement, then subject has role (P2868).
    • If the subject of the statement is the same as the target of the qualifier in the context of the statement, then "identity of subject".
    • applies to part (P518) is used when the statement only applies to a part of the subject, but the examples that require this property applies to all of the subject.
  • There are two main types of scenarios where this qualifier is needed:
    • Some entities have different periods of history covered by different items, e.g. Italian Navy (Q833040) - Royal Italian Navy (Q855186).
    • Some entities (organisations, people, political entities) "fly different flags" in different situation, e.g. Taiwan (Q865) - Chinese Taipei (Q216923). Deryck Chan (talk) 23:33, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
•  Support David (talk) 07:35, 30 November 2017 (UTC)
• How about "identity of subject in context"? ChristianKl (✉) 23:19, 30 November 2017 (UTC)
  • "Identity of subject in context" sounds good too. Deryck Chan (talk) 11:36, 1 December 2017 (UTC)
• @Deryck Chan, ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2, Swpb, ArthurPSmith, Jheald:  Done Created as ESCO skill ID (P4644). ChristianKl (✉) 19:26, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
  • @ChristianKl: ...wrong datatype!!! It should be item, not external identifier. Deryck Chan (talk) 19:39, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

 Done Ah, now it's right at identity of subject in context (P4649). ChristianKl (✉) 19:45, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

• • • Thank you! Deryck Chan (talk) 20:44, 12 December 2017 (UTC)