Wikidata:Property proposal/nombre d'essais marqués

number of tries marked edit

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Sports

Done: number of tries marked (P9927) (Talk and documentation)

Description	number of tries marked during a competition of rugby
Data type	nombre entier-invalid datatype (not in Module:i18n/datatype)
Template parameter	« nombre d'assaigs » dans ca:Plantilla:Competició esportiva -->
Allowed values	nombre entier
Allowed units	nombres entiers
Example 1	2000 Six Nations Championship (Q1612128) → 75
Example 2	1999 Five Nations Championship (Q1421857) → 45
Example 3	2019–20 Premiership Rugby (Q64521002) → 757
Source
Planned use	Usage hebdomadaire

Motivation edit

Les championnats de rugby, toutes compéticions confondues, prennent en compte le nombre de points marqués, (propriété P1351), et aussi d'essais. Il serait intéressant de prévoir une telle propriété afin d'enrichir la base de donnée.

Dans un premier temps, je soumets à votre avis cette proposition qui correspondant au nombre d'essais marqués au cours de la compétition en question.

Discussion edit

Question I don't quite understand what you exactly want to model. Could you please show a few examples? Thanks you, --Mad melone (talk) 11:30, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support For using like total goals in career (P6509) (Q615#P6509). Сидик из ПТУ (talk) 09:19, 10 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support, an important property for sports.--Arbnos (talk) 14:46, 14 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose This and a dozen other proposals relate to very specific aspects of a player’s or a match’s sports statistics. The number of casuistry of each sport can lead us to an inflation of the number of properties that, despite being correct, could have a low maintenance due to their difficulty.

I propose, instead, to create a wildcard property similar to P2670, where the main value would be the "statistical concept" (what we are now asking for as properties), and the qualifiers would be P1114, P5249, P710 (when they are using in a computer), etc. In other words that is:
Concept + quantity, + period (season or time), represents the total for that period by the holder of the item (person or team).

Concept + quantity, + period, + participant, represents the total for that period by a member of the item holder

~~I ask that before approving these properties, we can discuss whether the proposal makes sense and obviously do more precise and developed work than what I now present. Thanks~~ Amadalvarez (talk) 20:18, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Amadalvarez:

I think there is a balance to be had between maximum denormalization / rationalization of the database and general usability, and I fear such an approach moves too far towards the first at the expense of the second. Data entered as such is going to be much harder to read, to query etc and in my mind reduce how easy it is for users to actually reference the data.

Why single out sports statistics for such a schema, why not move all numerical data into a single property, be it astronomy, biology, political results etc into this one property and separate it all via qualifiers ?

I'd also be concerned about the fact that there is already significant volume of sporting data entered using the existing dedicated properties. Would you propose to delete all that data and then force it to be entered again under the new schema ? Having some data entered in the existing dedicated properties, and other data into this highly standardized schema seems a bad approach.

In the grand scheme of things, each sport is only going to have a few properties that are specific to that sport, the key is to ensure they are well named, and properties that can be shared across sports (for example a total goals property can be shared across hockey, soccer, handball etc) are used as such.

CanadianCodhead (talk) 14:55, 4 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support For this property, after a good explanation from CanadianCodhead. Amadalvarez (talk) 06:04, 24 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comment there are no values provided for the examples. This cannot be created until the values are supplied. UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 08:00, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@UWashPrincipalCataloger: Fix it !. Thanks, Amadalvarez (talk) 20:49, 1 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Amadalvarez, Mad melone, Сидик из ПТУ, Arbnos, CanadianCodhead: Done as number of tries marked (P9927). UWashPrincipalCataloger (talk) 00:56, 2 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]