Wikidata:Property proposal/religion or world view

religion or world view edit

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Generic

Done: no label (P8929) (Talk and documentation)

Description	religious or world view affiliation of a person, organization or religious building
Represents	religion or world view (Q71966963)
Data type	Item
Domain	item (persons, corporate bodies), e.g. Hans Modrow (Q57241)
Allowed values	item (persons, corporate bodies
Example 1	Bertrand Russell (Q33760) → atheism (Q7066)
Example 2	David Malet Armstrong (Q1173590) → naturalism (Q56000)
Example 3	William Stewart Ross (Q2580659) → agnosticism (Q288928)
Example 4	Leo von Caprivi (Q10873) → Catholicism (Q1841)
Example 5	Rudolf Steiner (Q78484) → anthroposophy (Q184719)
Planned use	I would like to use this property in a to-be-built linked-data contemporary-history dataset held by a German research centre.
See also	political ideology (P1142), religion or worldview (P140)

Motivation edit

Properties religion (P140) and political ideology (P1142) do not intersect nor overlap. Yet I suggest to create the property "religion or world view" that would incorporate both of them in a consistent way. This property would like to describe the religious or ideological affiliation in a more comprehensive way than the afore-mentioned properties do. The to-be-created property wishes first of all to express the German fixed expression "Religionszugehörigkeit oder Weltanschauung", which has a broad use and a high frequence in German-speaking countries, and for which the property religion (P140) is not equivalent. Yet the use of the property "religion or world view" would be helpful for every linguistico-cultural context in order to describe the affiliation of an individual, may he be catholic, atheist, agnostic or polytheist. – The preceding unsigned comment was added by F.Gelati (talk • contribs).

Discussion edit

Support if P140 and P1142, became redundant, are then deleted. Oppose otherwise. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 20:13, 23 October 2019 (UTC).[reply]
Deleting Property:P140 and Property:P1142 is in my understanding premature. P140 is more appropriate e.g. when describing places of worship, because a marginal number of them are agnostic or atheist. P1142 is based on the clearly-defined same-name class Q12909644 and I would not consider it redundant. In my view, all three of them can coexist. User:F.Gelati
I'd like to see some more examples (perhaps you have some from German-speaking countries?) where this property would be required and the existing properties would not be sufficient. Your examples so far don't, I think, meet that standard. ArthurPSmith (talk) 16:44, 24 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
As an example, The German Biography displays personalities' confession: for atheists, e.g. E.Krenz or E.Honecker, the field bears a "/", which is not exhaustive. This database displays religious confessions only but no world view. Creating the property "religion or world view" would allow to solve this disparity. Alternatively, a property from World view could be created, for the relation between religion and world view is debated: see World view. --F.Gelati (talk) 09:36, 25 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Antroposophy is described in English Wikipedia as philosophy, and Nazism as ideology, whereas both of them may be defined as world views too, as their German-written pages do. This proofs in my understanding that the property "religion or world view" would offer an exhaustive alternative to such fragmented solutions. --F.Gelati (talk) 10:16, 25 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Support I'm inclined to view all of these as one or another kind of religion, but if the people accustomed to using religion or worldview (P140) don't want to broaden it in this fashion, then a new property makes sense to me. ArthurPSmith (talk) 17:50, 29 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Seems redundant with the existing properties. --Yair rand (talk) 00:51, 31 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per Yair rand. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:32, 21 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Support A natural parent of political ideology (P1142) and religion or worldview (P140) that supports values for which neither of those are appropriate. Suggest alias "philosophical position". Swpb (talk) 15:02, 27 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Support per Swpb as a parent to existing categories but not to replace them. Some world views can be clearly attributed to political or religious and others may not which is the reason for this proposal. --Hannes Röst (talk) 02:35, 6 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support, but I think we should just call it "worldview." That way, if either "political ideology" or "religion" apply to an item , then they should be used. In cases, when they don't, then "worldview" can be used. The-erinaceous-one (talk) 07:14, 13 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Actually, I suggest we use something more general than "worldview." What if we instead called it something like "philosophical view" or "philosophical stance"? My objection to merely using "worldview" is that it is unnecessarily restricting---a person could have any number of notable philosophical beliefs that aren't "worldviews." For instance, philosophical beliefs about epistemology, ethics, aesthetics, or logic are not "worldviews" but might still merit inclusion in Wikidata. The-erinaceous-one (talk) 07:26, 13 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- "philosophical view/stand" for me sounds like a thing that should be one of Empiricism/Naturalism/Pragmatism/Rationalism/Relativism/Skepticism or subclass. Orthogonal to religion, in other words. Also there are religion-centric stands, like Islamic philosophy (Q193104). --Lockal (talk) 12:10, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Whats gonna happen to political ideology (P1142) and religion or worldview (P140)?--Trade (talk) 12:08, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Deletion requested, Trade. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 19:31, 7 December 2020 (UTC).[reply]

@F.Gelati, Nomen ad hoc, ArthurPSmith, Yair rand, Pigsonthewing: @Swpb, Hannes Röst, The-erinaceous-one, Lockal, Trade: Done P8929 (P8929) Pamputt (talk) 22:15, 6 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Please add Wikidata usage instructions (P2559) to clarify the difference with religion or worldview (P140) Pamputt (talk) 22:18, 6 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]