Candalua

Welcome to Wikidata, Candalua!

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Best regards! Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 10:59, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

Ti ho risposto da me

Hello, Candalua. You have new messages at Sannita's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

--Sannita - not just another it.wiki sysop 14:08, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

Charter of the United Nations

Can you restore the local interwiki crosswiki of s:Charter of the United Nations? I have set up an edition-item for each of all the languages and linked them to Charter of the United Nations (Q171328). -- Lavallen (talk) 09:09, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Thanks Lavallen! I restored all interwikis. There is also Q564358. Candalua (talk) 09:29, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

And Du gamla, du fria (Q133261) and Edda (Q108652). I do not know exactly how to deal with these yet. The latter have more than one work-item and the Swedish version of the first has more than one text in one page. This is common on sv.source, and it maybe have to be handled like the "Bonnie and Clyde"-problem. -- Lavallen (talk) 09:39, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Du gamla, du fria (Q133261) partly  Done. Svws has split the page in three and one disambig and I expect enws to split their page in two or two and a disambig. -- Lavallen (talk) 15:55, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

Annals (Q564358)  Done -- Lavallen (talk) 16:56, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

Can you take a look at s:en:United States Declaration of Independence? I have removed the deleted ko:-link in some languages. -- Lavallen (talk) 10:26, 24 January 2014 (UTC)

Your edit to Augustus

I have undone your edit to Augustus because you erroneously added the Julian calendar date of this death. Dates are always stored in Wikidata in the Gregorian calendar. The user interface is defective. It used to have the ability to convert the stored Gregorian date as a Julian date if it was marked as being a Julian calendar date, but this ability was lost in reorganizations. This has been discussed at Wikidata:Project chat. Jc3s5h (talk) 13:55, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

I have reviewed your contribution history and see that you edit many dates. Please review all your edits before for dates before March 1, 1923, to make sure they are all stored in the Gregorian calendar. Jc3s5h (talk) 13:57, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jc3s5h, I changed the date from 17 to 19 august because that's the date cited in the BBC reference. I don't exactly understand the problem: from my edit diff, both dates, the previous one and the latter, look as if they're stored in Gregorian calendar... Am I missing something? Candalua (talk) 14:08, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

There are two problems with the edit. First is your statement "both dates, the previous one and the latter, look as if they're stored in Gregorian calendar". Your mistake is believing the user interface. In it's current state, the user interface ALWAYS displays whatever is store in the database, which should ALWAYS be a Gregorian date. The database also contains the URI of a calendar; this URI serves as a suggestion to the software that displays the date to the reader about which calendar to display the date in; the two choices are Julian or Gregorian. So the user interface will display the word Julian or Gregorian to indicate which URI was stored in the database, but the date in the database will be displayed in the user interface without any conversion. I suggest not paying attention to the user interface and looking at the diff to make sure the edit is correct.

The next problem is that historians (in English anyway) will normally write dates before 15 October 1583 in the Julian calendar, because the Gregorian calendar didn't exist before then. Also, if the story is about just one country, historians will normally write dates in the calendar that was in force in the topic country. The Julian calendar was in force as recently as 28 February 1923 (in Greece). So any date you find in a history book or article, or in Wikipedia, will have to be converted from Julian to Gregorian before adding to Wikidata, if the Julian calendar was in force at the place where the event associated with the date occurred. Jc3s5h (talk) 14:18, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

Jc3s5h: Hum, this is really confusing! Generally, for all dates before and including 4 October 1582 (not 1583), the date commonly used by everyone (on history books, etc.) is the one in the Julian calendar, which was the only calendar in use till that day. But instead, you are saying we should display the date in prolectic Gregorian, which hardly anyone uses... and we should accept that the interface shows a completely different date from what one would expect? And every time we have to go through this process of converting the date to prolectic Gregorian, and then converting it back into Julian when we want to display it somewhere? Sorry if I'm a bit skeptic, I assume this must have been discussed in details and agreed upon... but... is it really a good idea? Isn't it better to just treat all dates before 4oct1582 as Julian, regardless of the format used in the database? Candalua (talk) 14:33, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

(Insert comment composed before I saw next comment in thread) I hope you will agree it is useless to discuss whether this is a good idea for the project on user talk pages; ideas about making a major change to the project must be done on a page that many people read. This has been discussed to some degree in the following threads:

• WP:Project chat#Dates of birth and death
• WP:Prjoect chat#Add more calendars?
• WP:Project chat#More date problems
• Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2015/01#Which calendar was used?
• Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2015/01#Which calendar was used?

Jc3s5h (talk) 15:18, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

Jc3s5h, after reading more of the discussions going on, it seems to me that the real problem is not how we insert the date, but rather that this conversion (jul -> greg for storing, greg -> jul for displaying) should be done automatically by the interface for all dates pre-1582 (and the default calendar for pre-1582 date should be Julian, not Gregorian), which is not happening because of the bug you mentioned in your first message. Why is this bug not being fixed? Do you have any info about it? It certainly is a major obstacle towards a widespread use of Wikidata. Candalua (talk) 15:13, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

Some of the threads I included in my reply at 15:18 UTC include links to Phabricator tasks where the bug is being discusses. Jc3s5h (talk) 15:19, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

Jc3s5h , thanks for the links. Of course I don't expect to change project policies from my talk page :) I just wanted to know what you think about it. Anyway, as I understand this is not really a policy, it's a necessity induced by the bug: storing all dates in the same calendar is a merely technical choice, and it does make sense (to easily perform comparisons etc.), the only problem is that the conversion should be completely transparent to the user, who should not really need to know about it. The currenty situation is very frustating... Luckily you stopped me before I did too many edits, but still most of my recent edits will need to be reverted, which is very disappointing :( Please let me know if you get any updates on this problem. Bye, Candalua (talk) 09:42, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

My thought is that the issue is unavoidably complex, because the date of adoption of the Gregorian calendar varied from place to place. Although the number of years of recorded history between c. 6000 BC and 1582 is much greater than the number of years between 1582 and 1923, events of interest to readers which can be dated with an accuracy of 1 day are much more frequent (per year) in the later period. So the total number of events that will be entered into Wikidata with precision of 1 day or better may be roughly equal for the periods 6000 BC – 1582 (which probably should be Julian) and 1582–1923 (which require investigation of the calendar in force where the event occurred).

Another complexity is what to do about events before 1582 in an area that did not use the Gregorian calendar, such as China. Should those be converted to Gregorian or Julian? Since I'm not a historian, I'm not sure.

My preference is to make Gregorian the default for everything, and only do conversions if the editor specifically marks the date as Julian. Also, I would specify that it be the Julian proleptic calendar (the Julian rule of a leap year every 4 years in February, projected backward from the middle ages). The Julian calendar was not observed correctly in Rome from about 44 BC to AD 8, and there are not enough surviving records to be sure about exactly how the Romans inserted leap years during that period. Considering the heading of this thread, it is interesting that it was Augustus who corrected the leap year error.

Probably the user interface should pop up a warning to an editor who tries to insert a Julian date before 1 March AD 8, asking the user to confirm the date is in the Julian proleptic calendar. Jc3s5h (talk) 13:21, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

Your edit to Shakespeare

You entered incorrect information for the date of Shakespeare's baptism. You changed the calendar from Gregorian to Julian. In addition to the BBC reference contained in the item, you can look at a copy of the parish register entry:

http://internetshakespeare.uvic.ca/Library/SLT/life/childhood/childhood.html

The provided translation indicates the date was 26 April 1564. Since the register had to be in the Julian calendar, since the Gregorian hadn't been invented yet, it corresponds to 6 May 1564. I have repaired the entry to indicate 6 May 1564 is a Gregorian date. Jc3s5h (talk) 15:48, 23 October 2015 (UTC)

I'm really tired of this madness. If the register was in the Julian calendar and the Gregorian calendar hadn't been invented yet, then why did you convert it to a Gregorian date???? That doesn't really make sense!!! Just use Julian dates before 1582 and Gregorian later! And put both when and where both calendars were in use. Otherwise you will just generate more and more confusion. Candalua (talk) 20:32, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

I have added the Julian date and removed the Gregorian date. Jc3s5h (talk) 03:15, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

Ladin

Hi Candalua,

I'm currently working on adding language codes to monolingual text. You requested Ladin in phab:T74126, and I would like to add lld. Per Help:Monolingual text languages, I want to see a real-world usage of it before adding it, though. Can you provide me with a statement and a reference for that statement that needs lld? Thanks, Adrian Heine (WMDE) (talk) 09:42, 25 February 2016 (UTC) PS: I'm really sorry about the calendar model confusion; that was probably the worst mistake the development team ever did :(

Hi Adrian, thank you for your message. One example is Q19139369; it's a translation of the fable Sleeping Beauty in Ladin language, so I would like to add the property "title", but language is required and lld is not recognized. (BTW, I think language should not be mandatory, at least in this case: a title of a work of art can be a number, or an invented word without actual meaning). I started some experimentations in the Italian Wikisource with this item (s:it:Ra Bela Indromenzada inze l bosco; the pink header is built with Wikidata data). On it.ws we will like it very much to move all data about works and editions to WD; the missing lld code is a minor obstacle, however what is really stopping us is still phab:T49930 and the lack of an easy and practical way to edit WD data from it.ws. Candalua (talk) 11:30, 25 February 2016 (UTC)

(Another property that now comes to my mind: Property:P1448 "official name". It will be useful for the municipalities and other entities in Italy that have an official Ladin name, like Q255568. --Candalua (talk) 11:36, 25 February 2016 (UTC) )

Hi, that's nice work there :) Wikisource projects have arbitrary access. Editing from client wikis will take some time, though. In general, language is required, but you have special codes available that should solve the use cases you mentioned. As for lld, it will probably take one or two weeks to be available. You can track progress on phab:T125066. Adrian Heine (WMDE) (talk) 11:49, 25 February 2016 (UTC)

Borse Alessio Guidetti per Wikimania 2016

Ciao, un messaggio dalla Commissione Borse Alessio Guidetti Ciao, come forse saprai quest'anno Wikimania, il raduno annuale delle comunità Wikimedia, si terrà a Esino Lario (Lecco) dal 22 al 28 giugno. Come per le scorse edizioni dell'evento, anche per il 2016 l'associazione Wikimedia Italia intende rendere disponibili alcune borse di partecipazione. Potete trovare il bando di partecipazione con tutti i dettagli a questo link. La scadenza è il 30 aprile 2016, ore 23:59 CEST. Trovate invece tutte le informazioni su Wikimania Esino Lario sul sito ufficiale dell'evento Grazie, e un sincero augurio di buon lavoro e buon divertimento sull'enciclopedia libera :-) per non ricevere più questa tipologia di messaggi rimuovi il tuo nome da queste liste

Alexmar983 13:24, 24 April 2016 (UTC)