Wikidata:Property proposal/Principal Galaxies Catalogue ID

Principal Galaxies Catalogue ID edit

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Authority control

Done: Principal Galaxies Catalogue ID (P4095) (Talk and documentation)

Description	identifier of an astronomical object, in the Principal Galaxies Catalogue
Data type	External identifier
Template parameter	currently used in `\|names=` in en:Template:Infobox galaxy (example: en:Messier 84); could be made a distinct parameter there
Domain	astronomical objects
Allowed values	\d+
Example	Messier 84 (Q14033) → 40455
Source	over 8,000 values already in Wikidata
Planned use	convert from catalog code (P528)
Formatter URL	http://ned.ipac.caltech.edu/cgi-bin/objsearch?objname=PGC+$1

Motivation

According to this query we have 8,416 Principal Galaxies Catalogue (Q1479861) IDs, used in catalog code (P528). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:28, 9 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. Applying a unique property also has other advantages:

Constraints can be applied, and thus errors more easily detected and fixed
Standard tool like "current uses", "count", etc., will be available (for examples, see the talk page of any existing external ID)
Tools like Resolver can be used - see for example, https://tools.wmflabs.org/wikidata-todo/resolver.php?prop=P496&value=0000-0003-4402-5296

There is also precedence, in SIMBAD ID (P3083). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:19, 11 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion

Support since this has a formatter URL and is quite widely used this sounds useful ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:00, 9 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Support, this approach is better than catalog code (P528). — Ivan A. Krestinin (talk) 20:42, 9 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

~~Oppose~~ This is a useful ID to have recorded in Wikidata, but it is not one of the main ones that is currently used in astronomy research. The formatter URL given here is specifically for the NASA/IPAC Extragalactic Database (Q488563), which is a different database from PGC and would be better served by a property related specifically to that database. It also duplicates existing IDs, such as the example given for a Messier object (Q14530). It is easier to fetch alternative IDs for the galaxy infobox by querying values of catalog code (P528) than trying to identify which ID properties are relevant for astronomy (as opposed to Wikibase/Quora/etc.). Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 01:45, 10 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Alternative formatter URLs can be included; and if there is a better one, it can be given priority. "over 8,000 values already in Wikidata" suggests that this is significant. It is unwise to rely on catalog code (P528) for subject-specificity; the next Quora (or whatever) equivalent could as easily be applied using P528. Which value does this duplicate? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:25, 11 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Pigsonthewing: Rather than using NED, would a link to the HEASARC version of the catalog work? Ignore the duplication point - that was me misreading things. Quora isn't a catalog, so I'd have been surprised if that had used P528, but I guess there are other situations where this will be an issue. I'm not sure what the best long-term solution would be for saying "get the astronomical IDs", though, maybe something along the lines of authority control but just using astro IDs would be useful... Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 15:13, 17 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mike Peel: What would be the HEASARC URL be, for Q14033's "40455" ID? We can use multiple formatter URLs, of course, giving one preference. Or use third-party formatter URL (P3303). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 22:11, 17 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Pigsonthewing: Hmm, it doesn't seem easy to link to an individual entry of a catalog on HEASARC - it's mostly a searchable database instead. However, Vizier would work - here's the link to the example. Change recno to different entry numbers, and it seems to load OK. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 09:14, 22 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Can you provide a bit more information about what the Principal Galaxies Catalogue happens to be in the descrition? ChristianKl (talk) 13:48, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Pigsonthewing, Ivan A. Krestinin, Mike Peel, ChristianKl: Done ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:06, 30 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]
- @Pigsonthewing, ArthurPSmith: Did you see my comment about VizieR above - can we use that instead of NED? Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 21:25, 30 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  - @Mike Peel: sorry I did not read that closely - if you'd like to change the formatter URL on the property go ahead, that seems fine to me. Or I'll take a look at it again in a couple of days. ArthurPSmith (talk) 14:24, 3 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  - @Mike Peel: Only now. I see that the page you link to says "recno... Should Not be used for identification". The recno in your link is 42611, but the PGC ID is 40455 - are they supposed to be for the same object? Or did you mean to link to recno=40455 ? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:41, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    - @Pigsonthewing: Sorry, PGC= should be used rather than recno=. See [1]. I hadn't noticed that they were different IDs. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 13:24, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
      - @Mike Peel: Happy to use that as the preferred formatter URL (we can use NED as well; multiple values are allowed). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 18:30, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]