Property talk:P2092

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Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID
identifier for an artwork in Bildindex

Associated item	Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur (Q860888)
Applicable "stated in" value	Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur (Q860888)
Data type	External identifier
Domain	According to this template: work of art (Q838948) According to statements in the property: work of art (Q838948), artwork series (Q15709879), artificial physical object (Q8205328) or building (Q41176) When possible, data should only be stored as statements
Allowed values	\d+
Example	Two men contemplating the Moon (Q232087) → 00003718 Votive Panel of Jan Očko of Vlašim (Q17149530) → 20369391
Source	http://www.bildindex.de/
Formatter URL	https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj$1
Tracking: usage	Category:Pages using Wikidata property P2092 (Q45312573)
See also	MHK object ID (P5407), Kulturelles Erbe Köln object ID (P4582)
Lists	Items with the most statements of this property Count of items by number of statements (chart) Items with the most statements Items with the fewest statements Count of items by number of sitelinks (chart) Items with the most sitelinks Items with the most sitelinks, but no link to one Wikipedia (sample: Welsh Wikipedia, cywiki) Items with the fewest sitelinks Most linked wikis Items with the most identifier properties Items with no other external identifier Items with no other statements Most recently created items Items with novalue claims Items with unknown value claims Usage history (total) Usage history (main statement) Chart by item creation date Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092 Map Random list
Proposal discussion	Proposal discussion
Current uses	Total 911 Main statement 808 88.7% of uses Qualifier 2 0.2% of uses Reference 101 11.1% of uses
Search for values

[create Create a translatable help page (preferably in English) for this property to be included here]

Format “\d+”: value must be formatted using this pattern (PCRE syntax). (Help)

List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Format, hourly updated report, SPARQL

Distinct values: this property likely contains a value that is different from all other items. (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303). Known exceptions: The Arrest of Christ with kiss of Judas and ear of Malchus (Q27518439), The Resurrection (Q27519765), Archduke Leopold Wilhelm in his Gallery in Brussels (IV) (Q19960947), The Gallery of Archduke Leopold in Brussels (II) (Q19960948), The Gallery of Archduke Leopold in Brussels (III) (Q27919340), The Gallery of Archduke Leopold in Brussels (I) (Q27919851), Pala Bichi (Q54692597)
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Unique value, SPARQL (every item), SPARQL (by value)

Type “work of art (Q838948), artwork series (Q15709879), artificial physical object (Q8205328), building (Q41176)”: item must contain property “instance of (P31)” with classes “work of art (Q838948), artwork series (Q15709879), artificial physical object (Q8205328), building (Q41176)” or their subclasses (defined using subclass of (P279)). (Help)

List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Type Q838948, Q15709879, Q8205328, Q41176, hourly updated report, SPARQL

Item “location (P276)”: Items with this property should also have “location (P276)”. (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Item P276, search, SPARQL

Item “inception (P571)”: Items with this property should also have “inception (P571)”. (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Item P571, SPARQL

Allowed entity types are Wikibase item (Q29934200): the property may only be used on a certain entity type (Help)

List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Entity types, hourly updated report

Scope is as main value (Q54828448), as reference (Q54828450): the property must be used by specified way only (Help)

List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Scope, hourly updated report, SPARQL

Label required in languages: de: Entities using this property should have labels in one of the following languages: de (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Label in 'de' language, search, SPARQL

Item “creator (P170)”: Items with this property should also have “creator (P170)”. (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Item P170, search, SPARQL

Item “copyright status (P6216)”: Items with this property should also have “copyright status (P6216)”. (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092#Item P6216, search, SPARQL

This property is being used by: ko:틀:위키데이터 속성 추적 Please notify projects that use this property before big changes (renaming, deletion, merge with another property, etc.)

unclear how to get ID from URL

I need ID for https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj02554072?part=1 object. Is there a way to get it? --Jarekt (talk) 20:10, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

@Jarekt: You've added it here without the part indication, I think there is only the ID for the whole, not the part, unfortunately.

We could allow values like "00001016&part=1" (you tried here) and fix the URL created using http://tools.wmflabs.org/wikidata-externalid-url/

Otherwise we still should agree on how to deal with the non-existing of IDs for the parts: Where to add this property, perhaps only using described at URL (P973) on the part items, I don't know. --Marsupium (talk) 11:28, 1 April 2019 (UTC)

Most recently, a so-called Objekt-PID has been added to all descriptions of artworks (and other objects, like buildings) within Bildindex. These URI's are not only persistent but can also identify objects which are described on a narrower level of a complex hierarchy. Your example with the current URL https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj02554072?part=1 refers to a description with Objekt-PID = http://id.bildindex.de/thing/0000652480 – while a URL based on the current definition of Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) would be https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj02554072 and refers to a description with Objekt-PID = http://id.bildindex.de/thing/0000652482. That means that changing the Formatter URL of this property from https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj$1 to http://id.bildindex.de/thing/$1 would make it possible to distinguish between entities on different description levels within Bildindex. See also the new topic below. -- Klaus Bulle DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg (talk) 08:58, 2 April 2024 (UTC)

Multiple values

Since some artworks or objects are sometimes photographed multiple times and not grouped on BildIndex. I would consider deleting the value limit to one. Dominikmatus (talk) 17:02, 23 March 2019 (UTC)

@Dominikmatus: With currently ca. 803 uses there are 2 exceptions and 14 violations, so at the moment max. 2% of the IDs affected. I'd say this is okay for the moment and if they are valid can be added as exception to constraint (P2303) to the constraint. But no strong opinion. --Marsupium (talk) 11:33, 1 April 2019 (UTC)

Looking at the number again now, the situation is different and maybe it should be changed as you said, I'm not sure. --Marsupium (talk) 14:49, 1 February 2023 (UTC)

It’s indeed the case that 1:n relationships exist between real world objects and Bildindex records describing those objects. That has multiple reasons, amongst others the fact that many institutions have contributed to the Bildindex database. Therefore, we agree to the proposal to remove the value limit to one.

However, we do strive to merge duplicate descriptions into one which means that in the end there will be only one Bildindex ID per object. What happens to the Bildindex ID of the replaced record? Those URI's following the current definition of Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) won’t retrieve any description anymore. To prevent that, we introduced the new "Objekt-PID" (see new topic below). All Objekt-PID’s of deprecated object descriptions will be forwarded to the Objekt-PID of the preferred description, thus ensuring that Objekt-PID’s will be truly persistent. Here’s an example: https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj20394370 has been merged into https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj20786740 and will be deleted soon. This won’t do any harm if the Objekt-PID is used as reference instead of https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj20394370 because it's Objekt-PID http://id.bildindex.de/thing/0001439045 is already redirected to http://id.bildindex.de/thing/0001729282. -- Klaus Bulle DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg (talk) 09:01, 2 April 2024 (UTC)

Do you have numbers by chance? Relevant here would be the percentage of objects with >1 (possible) values for Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092). This would a allow a well-grounded decision on the question whether or not to have this constraint. --Marsupium (talk) 16:45, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

According to my colleagues, there are about 5% of all entries in Bildindex (73,251 of 1,420,277) which are internally flagged as "Doppelerfassung". In fact it could be even more because not all duplicates are known. This is the reason why I would remove the single-value constraint (Q19474404) from this property and not add it to the proposed new property. -- Klaus Bulle DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg (talk) 07:53, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

Okay, then let's remove it here!

For the new one though, I though those Objekt-PIDs are unique?

Best, --Marsupium (talk) 09:09, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

We are working on it, as I mentioned above ('we do strive to merge duplicate descriptions into one'). But this is a long and partially 'painful' way to go, hence my suggestion not to use this constraint, neither for this nor the new property. -- Klaus Bulle DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg (talk) 09:27, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

I see. Considering the currently 787 violations here assuming that most of them are false positives I agree and I have removed the single-value constraint (Q19474404). --Marsupium (talk) 15:43, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

Proposal: change of property statements

Most recently, a so-called Objekt-PID has been added to all descriptions of artworks (and other objects, like buildings) within Bildindex. These URI's are not only persistent but can also identify objects which are described on a narrower level of a complex hierarchy. Thus helping to solve the issues mentioned by the other topics of this property talk. We would like to suggest to

1. change the property statements of Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) (see details below) and

2. modify all Wikidata entries currently using P2092

Re 1.: The following changes should be made to Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092):

statement	current	new
formatter URL (P1630)	https://www.bildindex.de/document/obj$1	http://id.bildindex.de/thing/$1
URL match pattern (P8966)	^https?:\/\/(?:www\.)?bildindex\.de\/document\/obj(\d+)	^http:\/\/id\.bildindex\.de\/thing\/(\d{10})$
format as a regular expression (P1793)	\d+	\d{10}

Re 2.: We are going to prepare a table that consists of all values of Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) currently used in Wikidata entries mapped to the last 10 digits of the corresponding Objekt-PID’s.

Immediately after someone with admin rights has changed the statements of Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) as described in step 1, we will run a script that updates all Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) values using QuickStatements. This won’t straight away improve most of the topics mentioned above but it’s the prerequisite of further (manual or automated) enhancements. At least we will solve the format constraint violations during our mapping, e.g. the Bildindex ID 00021379?part=4 will be replaced by 0001072915 thus linking to http://id.bildindex.de/thing/0001072915. -- Klaus Bulle DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg (talk) 08:54, 2 April 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for sharing this! This is very interesting to know. Is there any documentation online for the Objekt-PIDs? Maybe any API to help retrieving them? Regarding a property for the Objekt-PIDs a probably cleaner way – and the way it's mostly done here for similar cases – is to propose a new property. See Wikidata:Property proposal. If this causes any difficulties I could hopefully find the time to help with it. Then still retirement/deletion of Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) could be considered. Beste Grüße, --Marsupium (talk) 01:43, 3 April 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the quick and helpful feedback, @Marsupium! We agree to your suggestion and are going to propose a new property where we will also fix other issues with the partially misleading constraints of the current Bildindex ID. And we are working on an API, but this is still a long way to go ... However, our next delivery of data to Deutsche Digitale Bibliothek (Q621630) will contain the Objekt-PID as lido:objectPublishedID. Using https://labs.deutsche-digitale-bibliothek.de/app/ddbapi/ will give you our Objekt-PID, then. We're going to deliver new data, this year, but don't know when it will be available in Deutsche Digitale Bibliothek (Q621630). -- Klaus Bulle DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg (talk) 09:31, 3 April 2024 (UTC)

The proposal for a new property is online: Wikidata:Property proposal/Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur PID. It would be nice, @Marsupium, if you could help to review and improve it. At least we would like to get rid of some of the item-requires-statement constraint (Q21503247) constraints of Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) (e.g. collection (P195), inventory number (P217), made from material (P186), genre (P136), depicts (P180), height (P2048) and width (P2049)) because they don't make sense for items of class building (Q41176) and cause a lot of Wikidata:Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092. -- Klaus Bulle DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg (talk) 16:01, 12 April 2024 (UTC)

Hello, thanks for the property proposal! As for the mentioned item-requires-statement constraint (Q21503247)s, I think they are a separate issue. From my point of view they are a misuse of property constraints. I have removed them for now. Unfortunately, I think they are wider issue with currently no real consensus in the field of identifier properties for works of art and related stuff and you and me are not the first ones pointing out their harmful effect on the reports like Wikidata:Database reports/Constraint violations/P2092. Maybe we can get rid of them for this property for a while now; maybe a wider discussion of the issue will be necessary for all concerned properties. --Marsupium (talk) 16:32, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

This property is deprecated

Since the new property Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur PID (P12754) has been created, this is deprecated and shouldn't be used anymore. My colleague, @Hanna Meiners DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg, is going to update all Wikidata items that are linked to Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur ID (P2092) using QuickStatements in order to add a link to Bildindex der Kunst und Architektur PID (P12754). -- Klaus Bulle DDK Bildarchiv Foto Marburg (talk) 12:17, 29 May 2024 (UTC)