Wikidata:Property proposal/Differential diagnosis
differential diagnosis
editOriginally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Natural science
Not done
Description | MISSING |
---|---|
Data type | Item |
Domain | Diseases and disorders for living organisms |
Allowed values | Q template |
Example 1 | smallpox (Q12214) → chickenpox (Q44727), mpox (Q382370), impetigo (Q28971) |
Example 2 | chickenpox (Q44727) → smallpox (Q12214), mpox (Q382370), impetigo (Q28971) |
Example 3 | mpox (Q382370) → smallpox (Q12214), chickenpox (Q44727), impetigo (Q28971) |
Example 4 | impetigo (Q28971) → smallpox (Q12214), chickenpox (Q44727), mpox (Q382370) |
Source | en:Differential diagnosis |
Planned use | Differential diagnosis for diseases such as smallbpox |
Motivation
editI think that having differential diagnoses for diseases would be useful. (Please excuse any errors in the form of this proposal. This is my first proposal for a Wikidata property.) ↠Pine (✉) 08:16, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
Discussion
editPlease complete the examples. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 19:05, 9 December 2019 (UTC).
- @Pine: Thanks for creating a propoosal; I edited it slightly to better conform to our usual pattern. However as Nomen ad hoc said just above, the examples need to show how you plan to use this property - after the arrow you should provide the value you expect this property to have for each given disease. Also you have specified the type of the property as 'item' - that means the value would also be a Q item. Is that really what you intend? You may need to explain more or at least provide a reference. ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:52, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
- Hello @Nomen ad hoc, ArthurPSmith: this property would have the value of other Wikidata items which are differential diagnoses for the diagnosis that is the subject of each Wikidata item. I edited the links to show what I have in mind. ↠Pine (✉) 20:19, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
- OK, then Support. Best, Nomen ad hoc (talk) 20:23, 9 December 2019 (UTC).
- Hello @Nomen ad hoc, ArthurPSmith: this property would have the value of other Wikidata items which are differential diagnoses for the diagnosis that is the subject of each Wikidata item. I edited the links to show what I have in mind. ↠Pine (✉) 20:19, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
- Comment Looks good, but the boundaries can be clearer. 1 - What do you mean exactly by differential diagnosis? And 2 - couldn't the same modelling be achieved with the property different from? TiagoLubiana (talk) 11:20, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
- @TiagoLubiana: the English Wikipedia article at en:Differential diagnosis explains the concept. The different from property's documentation appears to emphasize different entities which have easily confused names. That is different from a differential diagnosis. A differential diagnosis may have a very different name from the original diagnosis, but its symptoms may be similar. If the Wikidata community wants to use the "different from" property to refer to "differential diagnosis" then I think that the examples in the "different from" property should be expanded to include two entities which have similar properties but very different names. Also pinging ArthurPSmith. ↠Pine (✉) 04:18, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
- Comment Hmm, I was expecting from the label that the values of the property would be in some way the mechanism for differentiating this disease from others, not just a list of other diseases it may be confused with... I think we already have existing properties that would cover that. Perhaps different from (P1889) as suggested above. ArthurPSmith (talk) 19:29, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
- Is anyone able to show structured data which already modeled this somehow? I think this might already exist somehow, and Wikidata could adapt an existing system. Blue Rasberry (talk) 11:40, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
- Comment What would be the reference for a differential diagnosis? I mean, fever can mean pretty much anything, I've seen Dengue mixed up with Malaria in the clinics, for example. Is there a database for these kind of association (as pointed out by Blue Rasberry below)?. In any way, the name should not be "differential diagnosis", as it does not link the two terms of interest. Wikipedia says that it is "distinguishing of a particular disease or condition from others that present similar clinical features". The link between two diseases would then be "similar clinical fatures". We already can cross that info via "Property:P780. Are there standard guidelines that strictly say when two diseases merit diff diagnosis? TiagoLubiana (talk) 20:43, 13 December 2019 (UTC)
- Comment As far as I understand w:fr:Diagnostic différentiel, your current 3 examples do not model a differential diagnosis (Q837512). Please change the name of your proposal. Visite fortuitement prolongée (talk) 21:54, 13 December 2019 (UTC)
Wait (given ArthurPSmith's comment) Useful IMHO. There is a lot of textbooks and research literature that can work as sources. Sorry for the short note only. See also https://schema.org/differentialDiagnosis. Do we have qualifiers to model the properties https://schema.org/DDxElement has? Cheers, --Marsupium (talk) 02:31, 19 December 2019 (UTC), 12:03, 21 December 2019 (UTC){{Support}}
- Comment Thanks Marsupium for the schema.org reference. I'd be a lot happier if we had a proposal to model all of these aspects of this problem in Wikidata. This particular proposal seems very limited at the moment and I don't see how it would be very useful on its own. ArthurPSmith (talk) 18:38, 19 December 2019 (UTC)
- @Marsupium, ArthurPSmith: For what it's worth, I think that schema.org's definitinon at https://schema.org/differentialDiagnosis is good, and is what I have in mind for Wikidata. ↠Pine (✉) 01:49, 28 December 2019 (UTC)
- @Pine: But you are proposing to model it very differently here. In your proposal, the property is applied to the disease, but with schema.org the property is on a "MedicalCondition", not the "DDxElement". I think this proposal would make more sense if the Q items it applied to were medical conditions like fever (Q38933) or abdominal pain (Q183425). However, in that case I think that would make this proposal simply an inverse property for symptoms and signs (P780), no? So I'm still not sure how this is a useful addition... ArthurPSmith (talk) 21:46, 30 December 2019 (UTC)
- @ArthurPSmith: The way that I see "differential diagnosis" used in English Wikipedia infoboxes for articles such as Smallpox is what I have in mind for the "differential diagnosis" property on Wikidata. I would be OK with using different from (P1889) instead of creating a new property if the description of P1889 is expanded with a relevant example. ↠Pine (✉) 20:39, 2 January 2020 (UTC)
- Wait the property needs a descriptions that makes it clear to readers who are not familiar with the term what it's about. ChristianKl ❪✉❫ 17:22, 11 May 2020 (UTC)
- @Pine, Nomen ad hoc, TiagoLubiana, Bluerasberry, Marsupium, ChristianKl: Not done Closing as stale. If a new proposal is created for this please reference this discussion. ArthurPSmith (talk) 16:18, 11 January 2021 (UTC)