Wikidata:Property proposal/UPA transcription

UPA transcription edit

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Generic

Done: UPA transcription (P6798) (Talk and documentation)

Description	transcript in Uralic Phonetic Alphabet
Represents	Uralic Phonetic Alphabet (Q1287368)
Data type	String
Domain	Use as a qualifier for statements with name properties on items, use as main value on forms for lexemes, specifically in Uralic and Turkic languages
Allowed values	many special characters and diacritics
Example 1	invalid ID (L47061#F1) → per̜ᵉves̜̀ḱ
Example 2	invalid ID (L3613#F1) → šᴉp
Example 3	invalid ID (L47182#F1) → to̬ɢ͕́̄ɢ͕́ᴱ
Example 4	⟨ Karelia (Q192273)    ⟩ native label (P1705) ⟨ Kaʹrjjeljânnam (sms) ⟩ UPA Search ⟨ Kar̀j̀ɐł-jɛ̮̀nnɐ̑m ⟩
Source	More info: http://kaino.kotus.fi/algu/index.php?t=etusivu&kkieli=en
Planned use	Record terminology in Uralic languages.
See also	THL Simplified Phonetic Transcription (P4189), Slavistic Phonetic Alphabet transcription (P5276), IPA transcription (P898)

Motivation edit

This property can be used to record phonetics in Uralic languages more precisely. Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 07:04, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion edit

Comment maybe the scope should be defined more clearly: use as a qualifier for statements with name properties on items, use as main value on forms for lexemes. Neither (current) sample reflects that. --- Jura 16:52, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- I agree with you, but looking at the sibling IPA proposal, it is not any better in that sense. –Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 16:57, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - The IPA proposal was just 6 days ago .. --- Jura 17:03, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    - This one is older https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property_talk:P898 –Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 17:07, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
      - Yeah, it's years, not days. Currently, the samples above should only be done in lexeme namespace. --- Jura 17:16, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - I hope the linguistic community here can help out in formulating the necessary constraints and scope. As far as I can see, there should be a mandatory language constraint, and it should be used with monolingual properties or lexemes. –Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) () 16:57, 25 May 2019 (UTC)
  - Putting it in another way, I think it should be treated similarly to IPA transcription (P898) however that is. – Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 17:12, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    - Some of the stuff is fine, other just needs to be moved to lexeme namespace. I don't think it's necessarily a sample to follow nor a default reason to approve any that would work the same going forward. --- Jura 17:16, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
      - I see no reason why transcription systems would be used/scoped/defined differently from each other. – Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 17:36, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
      - I was trying to make a lexeme example, but the creation failed. Adding the Skolt Sami language is in progress. phab:T217430. – Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 17:32, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
        Here we go: peeʹrvesǩ (L47061)
        Thanks! But there are remaining problems. – Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 18:04, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Support For some of the Saami languages, the only material we have for them is in UPA. -Yupik (talk) 17:22, 25 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

~~Oppose~~ given the unclear scope, the samples given and the general proposal to follow IPA statements that need cleaning up. I'd probably support a revised proposal addressing these issues. --- Jura 05:57, 26 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- I had already revised the scope according to your suggestion. We are still missing an example for a monolingual item such as a toponym. I do not have the expertise myself to create it. – Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 08:03, 26 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - Missed that, sorry. Support I fixed the third sample. The second sample would be for F1 as well? --- Jura 10:15, 26 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- I see I did not add the remark to a correct location. Fixed. – Susanna Ånäs (Susannaanas) (talk) 08:08, 26 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Support David (talk) 06:25, 26 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Support NMaia (talk) 22:35, 27 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Support Liamjamesperritt (talk) 08:51, 30 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Strong support--Tinker Bell ★ ♥ 02:00, 1 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Done @Susannaanas, Yupik, NMaia, Liamjamesperritt, Tinker Bell:,David: please make good use of it.--- Jura 10:01, 1 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Thank you! -Yupik (talk) 15:47, 1 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]