Wikidata:Property proposal/Jiten Online kanji ID

Jiten Online kanji ID

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Authority control

   Not done

Description	identifier for a CJK character on Jiten Online
Represents	Jiten Online (Q115665803)
Data type	External identifier
Domain	CJKV (Q53764732)
Allowed values	\d+
Example 1	维 (Q109757480) → 26151
Example 2	基 (Q54901253) → 670
Example 3	数 (Q54553170) → 168
Example 4	据 (Q55414623) → 1773
Source	https://kanji.jitenon.jp/
External links	Use in sister projects: [ar] • [de] • [en] • [es] • [fr] • [he] • [it] • [ja] • [ko] • [nl] • [pl] • [pt] • [ru] • [sv] • [vi] • [zh] • [commons] • [species] • [wd] • [en.wikt] • [fr.wikt].
Number of IDs in source	27693
Expected completeness	eventually complete (Q21873974)
Implied notability	Wikidata property for an identifier that does not imply notability (Q62589320)
Formatter URL	see below – WRONG FORMAT, MISSING "$1"
See also	GlyphWiki ID (P5467), Wikidata:Property proposal/Kanjipedia ID
Applicable "stated in"-value	Jiten Online (Q115665803)
Single-value constraint	yes
Distinct-values constraint	yes
Wikidata project	WikiProject CJKV character (Q114615731), WikiProject Japan (Q8504015)

Motivation

Jiten Online is a Japanese online dictionary. It has a large amount of kanji data sometimes including hanzi or hanja.  – The preceding unsigned comment was added by Laftp0 (talk • contribs).

Discussion

•  Comment Do you know what the different prefixes signify? I.e. is there a systematic difference between kanjiy, kanjib, etc.? --Nw520 (talk) 09:55, 25 November 2022 (UTC)

  It just seems to move to next alphabet every 500 entries like 001~500 is "kanji" and 501~1000 is "kanjib". But it doesn't move from "kanjiy" which has more than 15000 entries. Also kanji[b-y] can be replaced with "kanji_". e.g: https://kanji.jitenon.jp/kanji_/26151.html Laftp0 (talk) 10:30, 25 November 2022 (UTC)

   Support In this case I'd prefer not including the prefix in the properties' value and linking to "kanji_" instead. For example: Formatter https://kanji.jitenon.jp/kanji_/$1.html, value 26151. --Nw520 (talk) 16:38, 26 November 2022 (UTC)

  Yes it's better but it doesn't work with "kanji/" which doesn't include alphabet. Laftp0 (talk) 02:24, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

•  Support looks like a useful site. does this site just catalogue kanji? if so i think "kanji" can be dropped from the identifier, leaving either a number or an ID in the form "b/670". Infrastruktur (talk) 11:37, 25 November 2022 (UTC)

  This site seems to have a sister site that might be useful. [1], [2], [3], [4], [5], [6], [7], [8]. Syunsyunminmin (talk) 13:12, 25 November 2022 (UTC)

• Bravefoot
  Okkn (talk)
  Camillu87
  User:Araisyohei
  Tris T7 ^{TT me}
  higa4
  Mcampany
  Mzaki
  NMaia
  Siramatu
  Mochimap
  Spinster
  Haansn08
  Shisma(UTC)
  Syunsyunminmin
  Yirba
  
  Notified participants of WikiProject Japan --Nw520 (talk) 09:57, 25 November 2022 (UTC)
•  Support

formatter URL	https://kanji.jitenon.jp/kanji/$1.html edit applies if regular expression matches ^\d\d{0,1}$|^[1-4]\d{2}$|^500$ series ordinal 1 0 references add reference https://kanji.jitenon.jp/kanji_/$1.html edit series ordinal 2 0 references add reference
		add value

Is this not allowed?

Syunsyunminmin (talk) 12:53, 25 November 2022 (UTC)

•  Support --Okkn (talk) 05:50, 26 November 2022 (UTC)
• I support Syunsyunminmin's formatter. "kanji" prefix is really unnecessary, but it's a little unnatural that identifiers start with /. Laftp0 (talk) 06:36, 26 November 2022 (UTC)
•  Weak oppose I also find that site useful. However, the operating company is small and there are concerns about permanence.（私もサイトは有用だと思います。しかし、運営会社が小さく永続性に不安があります。）--Camillu87 (talk) 15:10, 27 November 2022 (UTC)

• @Camillu87:As per consensus rules, the closing property creator is free to disregard claims that are not substantiated. Do you have a reference that supports the claim that the company might be in trouble? Infrastruktur (talk) 19:20, 28 November 2022 (UTC)

  The operating company was established in 2020 with capital of 3 million yen and 4 employees.([9],[10]) It is an unnamed company and website where no useful mention can be found even if you search on google etc., so it is doubtful whether it will still be in operation 5 or 10 years from now. I have no further information.（運営会社は2020年に設立され、資本金300万円、従業員4人の会社です。googleなどで検索しても有益な言及が見つからない無名の会社、webサイトですので、5年先、10年先も運営されてるかは疑問があります。それ以上の情報は持っていません。）--Camillu87 (talk) 13:44, 29 November 2022 (UTC)

  Wayback Machineを見ると少なくとも2015年から運営されているのが確認できますし、予測しても仕方ないので、何か問題が起きてから削除依頼でもお願いします Laftp0 (talk) 12:46, 3 December 2022 (UTC)

• If there are no objections, I'll apply the Syunsyunminmin's formatter above. Laftp0 (talk) 12:47, 3 December 2022 (UTC)

• @Syunsyunminmin: There is a bug in it, the first formatter should be "https://kanji.jitenon.jp/kanji$1.html", and the regex should be fixed up to match. Infrastruktur (talk) 14:42, 3 December 2022 (UTC)

  @Infrastruktur: There seems to be a misunderstanding between you and me. I expect the value of this property to be numeric only. ex, 26151 Syunsyunminmin (talk) 14:59, 3 December 2022 (UTC)

What Syunsyunminmin suggested won't work, Wikidata doesn't support applies if regular expression matches (P8460) (the property was created without any input from the Wikidata developers). - Nikki (talk) 18:55, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

• @Laftp0: I propose to close this proposal as stale after 31 January 2024. Please fix thr formatter URL issue, or comment if you don’t agree. Regards, ZI Jony ^(Talk) 05:45, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

   stale - see remarks above. Regards, ZI Jony ^(Talk) 07:54, 17 February 2024 (UTC)