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User talk:Pi zero

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Welcome to Wikidata, Pi zero!

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If you have any questions, please ask me on my talk page. If you want to try out editing, you can use the sandbox to try. Once again, welcome, and I hope you quickly feel comfortable here, and become an active editor for Wikidata.

Best regards! Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 12:42, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

Contents

Stop moving category linksEdit

Dear Pi zero, we have items for categories and subjects. Please don't move the links. (talk) 19:39, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

@Multichill: Wikinews categories do not correspond to Wikipedia categories, they correspond to Wikipedia articles. I really would have liked to explain in the edit summaries of my edits, but the software does not yet allow me to put useful edit summaries on edits. Wikinewsies all know this, but naturally Wikidatans are likely to be unaware.
See Wikidata:Wikinews/Development#Interproject links. --Pi zero (talk) 22:18, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
That's just a proposal, it never reached consensus. Please stop making a mess or you will find yourself blocked on this project. Multichill (talk) 08:01, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
@Multichill: I think you've misconstrued the page. It appears to be "proposed" in the sense of "we propose to link Wikinews from Wikidata at all". The alternative to the "proposal" would be not linking to Wikinews at all. Since Wikidata has decided to link to Wikinews, the preferred way to do that is as described on the page, and anything else — such as linking Wikinews categories from the items for Wikipedia categories — would be a rogue action (though not, one hopes, malicious).
The consequences of putting Wikinews categories in Wikipedia-category items would be — unless you can give me a technical assurance which I'll explain below — that, sooner or later, Wikipedia sister links would be generated from Wikidata, and Wikinews would be systematically deprived of every single sister link that ought to lead to it. Which, if done deliberately, would constitute vandalism against Wikinews on the most grandiose scale. I wouldn't even have been here, going through the frankly complicated and arduous process of straightening out the Wikidata links for Wikinews categories as I come to them, if we hadn't been alerted by another Wikinewsie that some of them were wrong. Now that I've looked at some, I'd guess that probably more than a thousand of them are wrong (I suspect that may be a conservative estimate), in an awful mess, with links randomly strewn between the items for Wikipedia Category:X, X, and Portal:X. Some of them are at least wrong in simple ways, but some can be a real bear to straighten out; which doesn't bother me, because at en.wn we curate an archive of about 20000 articles, and are quite accustomed to tackling a huge mess by patiently correcting things as we come to them. Your threat of blocking does concern me, as I already devote often ten to twelve hours a day to wikimedia (mostly en.wn and en.wb), and can ill afford the time for a major brouhaha at Wikidata, but since the stakes are systematically hiding all the Wikinews so essentially nobody who visits a Wikipedia article will ever notice Wikinews exists, it's obviously not something I can walk away from. Despite my hatred of unpleasantness. I'd been thinking if you continued undoing my corrections I was going to have to seek action against you here, and I was dreading it.
The matter of technical assurance. Is there a reason for us to believe that, despite the empirical evidence to the contrary (including the link I gave), when sister links are generated at Wikipedia from the Wikidata database, Wikipedia articles would be automatically sister-linked to Wikinews categories? I'm open to learning there's a reason to believe that would happen, though from what I understand, and what I see, of the technical infrastructure of Wikidata I would certainly be surprised (for example nobody would claim, surely, that your software support isn't in an awful tangle atm). --Pi zero (talk) 13:19, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
Until we have a worked out approach to handling Wikinews articles and categories on Wikidata that fits well with the needs of both Wikinews, Wikidata and the sister projects, threatening blocks seems rather overeager, Multichill. —Tom Morris (talk) 13:42, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
Especially for a content dispute you are involved in. The issue was raised, albeit in passing, on project chat recently without any sign of real objection. Also note the page linked above formed after very detailed discussion on the chat about wn links. Blood Red Sandman (talk) 13:53, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
Dear wikinews people, this is a wiki, we operate by concensus. The current consensus is to link to the most specific item. So if we have a subject item and a category item for the subject, the category sitelinks go to the category item. If you want to change this, start an RFC. Until a different consensus is reached me and other users will enforce the current consensus and if we have to block for that, so be it. So please, put your moves on hold, start an RFC and gather consensus. Might not be worth the effort because with arbitrary access you can link to whatever you like and that's probably deployed next month. Trying to turn this into something personal wasn't the smartest thing to do. Please don't do that, this is a friendly wiki and we like to keep it that way. Multichill (talk) 18:02, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
Multichill, with due respect, Wikinews topic cats are specifically analogous to Wikipedia articles. The fact that Wikinews pages corresponding to Wikipedia articles happen to be in Wikinews category space is entirely superficial. It gets even more complicated, I've noticed, when it comes to portals, since a few Wikinewses actually put their portals in mainspace but, nevertheless, ontologically they're portals. --Pi zero (talk) 18:23, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
@Multichill: I would be interested to know what you mean by "with arbitrary access you can link to whatever you like and that's probably deployed next month". Well, I understand the part about "probably depolyed next month" (though skepticism about software schedules is wise). --Pi zero (talk) 18:32, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Q649Edit

Hi, my edit happened automatically (I was reverting some move-vandalism, thereby causing the actual content page to be deleted accidentally; I then deleted the page to restore everything). I wasn't aware that the deletion would automatically make me remove the interwiki link on Wikidata. Thanks for reverting. --MF-W 19:18, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

re: Wikinews categoriesEdit

Hi, I'm sorry, I usually act in the right way, like this or this or this. But there are some cases of non-category mainspace which should be connected to ns0-items: in Västra Götaland County there is sv:Västra Götaland, so sv:n:Kategori:Västra Götalands län should go to Category:Västra Götaland County. The same for Allsvenskan and Category:Allsvenskan. I think that this decision of connecting wikinews categories to ns0 items is not adequate and should be revised, categories should be connected to categories (and interproject templates taught to link to other projects in another way, just like for Wikimedia Commons with property "category on Commons"). --Superchilum(talk to me!) 07:13, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

@Superchilum: Those sv mainspace pages you're talking about, the ones for topics, do not correspond to Wikipedia articles. They correspond to portals, as I realized a while back after wrestling with some of them. They should interwiki to and from portals on other-language Wikinews, and Wikinews portals link to the Wikidata items for Wikipedia portals. The corresponding sv topic categories then link, along with all other Wikinews topic categories, to the Wikidata items for Wikipedia articles.
I think there's also one other Wikines, besides sv, that puts its portals in mainspace, but I don't remember which one — the two-letter code might have started with "b"? --Pi zero (talk) 13:17, 1 April 2015 (UTC)
When I saw them I thought (and I still think) that they're more suitable to ns0-links than categories are. Anyway, now I know what to do in the future (I will follow those guidelines although I totally disagree with them). Thanks for your corrections. --Superchilum(talk to me!) 13:43, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Wikinews topic catsEdit

Thanks for the information, I didn't know that. Ciao, Ary29 (talk) 09:12, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Please undoEdit

Hi Pi zero, on Wikidata a category on Wikinews must be connected with an article on Wikipedia, Wikivoyage, etc. That is standing policy here. Can you please undo your actions on at least Finland, Uruguay and may be more? Thanks in advance! Ymnes (talk) 07:20, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

@Ymnes: Huh? I know the policy well, and have put much effort into fixing ones that were wrong; it's quite important to Wikinews, since we have been forced to have most interwikis driven from Wikidata. A Wikinews topic category (which is not all categories on Wikinews, but most of them) is linked from the same Wikidata item as the corresponding Wikipedia article. Lately, due to some very helpful infrastructure work being done at Wikinews by Green Giant, I've had occasion to check a whole lot of these at Wikidata, and found quite a lot of them had been mislinked here, even some that I'm pretty sure were correct when I checked them here a few years ago. Is it possible that, with so many of them to check, I got some of them backwards? What an awful thought. I'll look into it as soon as I can. --Pi zero (talk) 11:58, 2 June 2018 (UTC)
@Ymnes: I see that atm Finland (Q33) and Uruguay (Q77) are correctly linked. --Pi zero (talk) 12:04, 2 June 2018 (UTC)
I may have been mistaken, I am travelling and looking at it from a mobile device. I'll look again later. Ymnes (talk) 12:59, 2 June 2018 (UTC)
I was mistaken indeed. Sorry! Ymnes (talk) 14:55, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
@Ymnes: No worries. Occasional false positives are a trivial price in exchange for likelihood of catching each other's flubs. :-)  --Pi zero (talk) 15:49, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
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