Wikidata:Property proposal/Academic rank

Academic rankEdit

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Person

   Not done

professorship (P803) is only for specific chairs; this property would be applicable to all generic academic ranks. I also think that a dedicated property would be more convenient and accurate than only using position held (P39) (and even more than occupation (P106), as I see sometimes). Nomen ad hoc (talk) 15:40, 5 July 2019 (UTC).

(We could also widen it to research positions, such as Director of Research at CNRS (Q3029430).)

<ping project should not be used in an indented reply> Pintoch
Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits
ArthurPSmith
Vladimir Alexiev (talk)
Toniher
Runner1928
Daniel Mietchen (talk)
Satpal Dandiwal (talk)
danielt998
Sush_0809 (talk)
John Samuel Nomen ad hoc
OdileB(talk)
Ivanhercaz
Mlemusrojas
Jjfloyd
Kippelboy
Germartin1
Benjamenta
Simon Cobb
Mathieu Saby
Kiwi2020
Saethydd
Epìdosis
Gengrubber (talk) 04:40, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
Blue Rasberry (talk)
Walkuraxx
Sdkb (talk) IbiloyeAC2 [[User talk:IbiloyeAC2|talk]

  Notified participants of WikiProject Universities. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 15:42, 5 July 2019 (UTC).

<ping project should not be used in an indented reply> User:fnielsen Daniel Mietchen Egon Willighagen Vladimir Alexiev Pintoch Simon Cobb User:Oa01 Nomen ad hoc (talk) 15:43, 5 July 2019 (UTC) User:Hannes Röst

  Notified participants of WikiProject Research projects. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 15:43, 5 July 2019 (UTC).

<ping project should not be used in an indented reply> Daniel Mietchen DarTar Ppgardne Michael Cochez Alexander Doria Maximilianklein Renepick Lambert Heller Beat Estermann Cornelia Flavia Veja Tobias1984 Silvio Peroni Alastair Dunning Aubrey Snipre Andrew Su Karima Rafes Alen Vodopijevec Henry Rzepa Scott Edmunds Emw Matthiassamwald Missvain Vladimir Alexiev Petermr WiseWoman Jodi.a.schneider NavinoEvans Jan van Oort Andy Mabbett Konrad Foerstner Egon Willighagen Ben Moore Z. Ainali HLHJ Ale Abdo a.k.a. Solstag jibe-b GuZ-MPG Kristina Hettne Lilaroja Runner1928 Almondega lv_ra Finn Årup Nielsen (fnielsen) Rudy Patard ArthurPSmith Diana de la Iglesia Netha Pintoch OdileB YULdigitalpreservation Lozana Rossenova Jonathan Brier a.k.a. wolfgang8741 Jneubert econterms T0mpr1c3 Vladimir Alexiev Ivanhercaz Trilotat Benjamenta Nomen ad hoc Tris T7 TT meSimon Cobb Alessandro Marchetti sky Juliansteinb Maria zaos Josephguillaume Cavernia GoEThe Pamputt TiagoLubiana iopensa Walkuraxx

  Notified participants of WikiProject Wikidata for research. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 15:44, 5 July 2019 (UTC).

  •   Support David (talk) 06:40, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
  •   Comment Can you plz elaborate on this? What makes it more accurate and more convenient? I am not sure at this moment what it adds, and then it only adds confusion. @Hannolans, Linnborghuis, Sjoerddebruin: how does it relate to your efforts around Dutch professor positions? --Egon Willighagen (talk) 09:00, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
    The current situation is already confused: academic ranks are either declared as an occupation, or a position. Such property would fix this hesitation. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 08:42, 21 July 2019 (UTC).
  •   Oppose This property might be convienent but it is likely to make the distinction between the academic (Q3400985) and academic rank (Q486983) classes much less clear. In my opinion, it would be sensible to avoid doing that. Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 17:38, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
    Hi Simon, sorry, didn't see your comment prior. Would you have some examples of academic (Q3400985) subclasses? I think that the distinction wouldn't be very difficult: academic (Q3400985) subclasses would logically be for field of speciality, whereas academic rank (Q486983) rather refers to generical titles, shared by academics from all kinds of discipline. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 08:30, 21 July 2019 (UTC).
  •   Comment Hi, I have a problem with the description as a title which I have found on several of these things. The examples you give are not titles (a title is : Dr, Prof., etc). There are positions, functions and jobs. If you enter the issue of ranks, then you have in France for instance "professeur de 1ere classe" or "maitre de conférences de classe exceptionnelle", etc. Best, --Cgolds (talk) 08:40, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
  • Why not position held (P39)? ChristianKl❫ 13:00, 14 August 2019 (UTC)
    Why not; but currently the use is very disordered; very often these positions are declared as occupations (see e.g. for French professors); and furthermore, I was sometimes reverted while declaring it as a classical position. So a dedicated property would certainly stabilize the use. Nomen ad hoc (talk) 14:06, 14 August 2019 (UTC).
    Just define the rank as a subclass of the occupation. This is indeed a specific case. author  TomT0m / talk page 16:20, 16 August 2019 (UTC)
    @Nomen ad hoc: I’d do something like that :
    Et peut-être même
    • ⟨ academic in french university ⟩ disjoint union of (P2738)   ⟨ list values as qualifiers (Q23766486)      ⟩
      of (P642)   ⟨ maître de conférence ⟩
      of (P642)   ⟨ professeur d’université ⟩
      of (P642)   ⟨  ⟩
      . Même si il y a d’autre poste à prendre en compte, genre les chercheurs CNRS qui font pas d’enseignement mais on est plus dans l’université pour le coup. Et faudrait aussi intégrer les thésards qui font de la recherche et de l’enseignement, souvent. author  TomT0m / talk page 16:29, 16 August 2019 (UTC)
      Oppose introducing new standards because existing standards aren't used consistently is a bad idea. ChristianKl❫ 09:45, 19 August 2019 (UTC)
    Which are exactly the suitable standards for academic ranks? Nomen ad hoc (talk) 09:54, 19 August 2019 (UTC).
    It seems to me like exact standards aren't defined. If you want an exact definition the place to go is a relevant Wikiproject where you can reach consensus on a specific standard. ChristianKl❫ 07:15, 20 August 2019 (UTC)