Property talk:P248

Documentation

• Start a query
• Current uses
• Statistics by class
• List of values
• List of qualifiers
• Count

stated in
to be used in the references field to refer to the information document or database in which a claim is made; for qualifiers use P805; for the type of document in which a claim is made use P3865

Represents	reference (Q121769)
Data type	Item
Usage notes	Using this property indicates that the information is contained in the entity (a book, an article, etc) that's represented by the linked information source. If you want to state that the information comes from the information contained in another Wikidata item, use P3452.
Commons example	→ lucernewater (Q76822625)
Format and edit filter validation	Abuse filter #54
Robot and gadget jobs	DeltaBot does the following jobs: Move qualifier to source
Tracking: usage	Category:Pages using Wikidata property P248 (Q98107858)
See also	statement disputed by (P1310), statement is subject of (P805), imported from Wikimedia project (P143), inferred from (P3452), described by source (P1343), quotation or excerpt (P7081), applicable 'stated in' value (P9073), reference URL (P854), type of reference (P3865), published in (P1433)
Lists	Search Commons for files with property Items with no other statements Most recently created items Items with novalue claims Items with unknown value claims Usage history (total) Usage history (main statement) Database reports/Complex constraint violations/P248 Database reports/Constraint violations/P248 Map Random list
Proposal discussion	Proposal discussion
Current uses	Total 99,802,221 Main statement 983 <0.1% of uses Qualifier 116 <0.1% of uses Reference 99,801,122 >99.9% of uses
Search for values

[create Create a translatable help page (preferably in English) for this property to be included here]

Scope is as reference (Q54828450), as qualifier (Q54828449): the property must be used by specified way only (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#Scope, SPARQL

Value type “information (Q11028), work (Q386724), version, edition or translation (Q3331189), catalogue (Q2352616), database (Q8513), correspondence (Q1277575), information system (Q121182), project (Q170584), archive (Q166118), digital library (Q212805), information resource (Q37866906), news article (Q5707594), media (Q340169), group of video games often treated as a singular game (Q116779426), computer file (Q82753), file (Q117207263), register (Q19386377), manual (Q16363676), user guide (Q1057179)”: This property should use items as value that contain property “instance of (P31), subclass of (P279)”. On these, the value for instance of (P31), subclass of (P279) should be an item that uses subclass of (P279) with value information (Q11028), work (Q386724), version, edition or translation (Q3331189), catalogue (Q2352616), database (Q8513), correspondence (Q1277575), information system (Q121182), project (Q170584), archive (Q166118), digital library (Q212805), information resource (Q37866906), news article (Q5707594), media (Q340169), group of video games often treated as a singular game (Q116779426), computer file (Q82753), file (Q117207263), register (Q19386377), manual (Q16363676), user guide (Q1057179) (or a subclass thereof). (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303). Known exceptions: owner's manual (Q2377289)
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#Value type Q11028, Q386724, Q3331189, Q2352616, Q8513, Q1277575, Q121182, Q170584, Q166118, Q212805, Q37866906, Q5707594, Q340169, Q116779426, Q82753, Q117207263, Q19386377, Q16363676, Q1057179, SPARQL

None of English Wikipedia (Q328), Polish Wikipedia (Q1551807), German Wikipedia (Q48183), French Wikipedia (Q8447), Russian Wikipedia (Q206855), Dutch Wikipedia (Q10000), Czech Wikipedia (Q191168), Spanish Wikipedia (Q8449), Greek Wikipedia (Q11918), Wikipedia (Q52), Chinese Wikipedia (Q30239): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property: imported from Wikimedia project (P143)
Replacement values: (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

Allowed entity types are Wikibase item (Q29934200), Wikibase property (Q29934218), Wikibase lexeme (Q51885771), Wikibase form (Q54285143), Wikibase sense (Q54285715), Wikibase MediaInfo (Q59712033): the property may only be used on a certain entity type (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#Entity types

None of Pan European Game Information (Q192916), Entertainment Software Rating Board (Q191458), Unterhaltungssoftware Selbstkontrolle (Q157754), Australian Classification Board (Q874754), Office of Film and Literature Classification (Q1352932), British Board of Film Classification (Q861670), Game Rating and Administration Committee (Q483838): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of official website (Q22137024): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of DR (Q1164334), DR Nyheder (Q6333117): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: DR Nyheder (Q79955373) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of Conservapedia (Q17963), Encyclopedia Dramatica (Q159540), Kiwi Farms (Q63225180), 4chan (Q238330), Infogalactic (Q55075031), Metapedia (Q693899): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of European Film Awards (Q223740): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: europeanfilmawards.eu (Q101244563) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of Make Lists, Not War (Q97309629): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of BBC (Q9531), BBC News (Q1160945), BBC News (Q3274824), BBC News (Q787216): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: BBC News Online (Q4704926) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of Vice (Q249838): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: VICE.com (Q105072339) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of New York Magazine (Q1507987): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: nymag.com (Q93589669) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of Ekstra Bladet (Q1226253): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: ekstrabladet.dk (Q106204547) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of TV 2 News (Q7672275): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: TV2.dk (Q86599934) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of Berlingske (Q59055): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: berlingske.dk (Q86609048) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of CNN (Q48340): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: CNN.com (Q12217473) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of Time (Q43297): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: Time.com (Q111728681) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

None of Al Jazeera (Q13477), Al Jazeera English (Q4296040): value must not be any of the specified items.
Replacement property:
Replacement values: aljazeera.com (Q4727585) (Help)

Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Exceptions can be specified using exception to constraint (P2303).
List of violations of this constraint: Database reports/Constraint violations/P248#none of, SPARQL

Value shouldn't be an item for a date
use retrieved (P813) or publication date (P577) instead (Help)
Violations query: SELECT ?item ?itemLabel ?p ?value ?valueLabel { ?item ?p [ prov:wasDerivedFrom / pr:P248 ?value ] . ?value wdt:P31 wd:Q47150325 . SERVICE wikibase:label { bd:serviceParam wikibase:language "en" } } LIMIT 2000
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Complex constraint violations/P248#Value shouldn't be an item for a date

Value Wikinews (Q964) will be automatically replaced to value Wikinews (Q964) and moved to described by source (P1343) property. Testing: TODO list

Value Oxford Biography Index (Q17037575) will be automatically replaced to value Oxford Biography Index (Q17037575) and moved to described by source (P1343) property. Testing: TODO list

Value Register of Pallotines missionaries (Q50573136) will be automatically replaced to value Register of Pallotines missionaries (Q50573136) and moved to described by source (P1343) property. Testing: TODO list

Value Polish Wikipedia (Q1551807) will be automatically replaced to value Polish Wikipedia (Q1551807) and moved to imported from Wikimedia project (P143) property. Testing: TODO list

Value letter of consent (Q88798846) will be automatically replaced to value letter of consent (Q88798846) and moved to type of reference (P3865) property. Testing: TODO list

Value reproduction right (Q2857297) will be automatically replaced to value DACS register (Q71534274). Testing: TODO list

Value Poetry Foundation (Q7207490) will be automatically replaced to value www.poetryfoundation.org (Q110765386). Testing: TODO list

Value National Library Service of Italy (Q576951) will be automatically replaced to value OPAC SBN (Q105086090). Testing: TODO list

Value World Athletics (Q1158) will be automatically replaced to value World Athletics database (Q54960205). Testing: TODO list

Value Pan European Game Information (Q192916) will be automatically replaced to value PEGI Rating Database (Q105296817). Testing: TODO list

Value Entertainment Software Rating Board (Q191458) will be automatically replaced to value ESRB rating database (Q105295303). Testing: TODO list

Value Unterhaltungssoftware Selbstkontrolle (Q157754) will be automatically replaced to value USK Classification Database (Q105272106). Testing: TODO list

Value Australian Classification Board (Q874754) will be automatically replaced to value Australian Classification database (Q105296839). Testing: TODO list

Value British Board of Film Classification (Q861670) will be automatically replaced to value BBFC database (Q105296939). Testing: TODO list

Value Game Rating and Administration Committee (Q483838) will be automatically replaced to value GRAC rating database (Q108757281). Testing: TODO list

Value Infocomm Media Development Authority of Singapore (Q6030438) will be automatically replaced to value IMDA classification database (Q110673939). Testing: TODO list

Value Istituto Italiano dei Castelli (Q85864317) will be automatically replaced to value Atlante castellano d'Italia (Q112278664). Testing: TODO list

Value Unique Ingredient Identifier (Q6593799) will be automatically replaced to value Global Substance Registration System (Q116031405). Testing: TODO list

Value Buddhist Digital Resource Center (Q30324366) will be automatically replaced to value Buddhist Digital Archives (Q118954234). Testing: TODO list

Value Regional Council of Tuscany (Q3687399) will be automatically replaced to value www.consiglio.regione.toscana.it (Q121256246). Testing: TODO list

Value data.nlg.gr (Q105672736) will be automatically replaced to value Catalogue of the National Library of Greece (Q123524366). Testing: TODO list

This property is being used by: ast:Plantía:Persones/referencia eo:Ŝablono:Informkesto gravulo Please notify projects that use this property before big changes (renaming, deletion, merge with another property, etc.)

Discussion

URLs

How would one use URLs with this property? Does it make sense to create an item for a web page merely to use it for sourcing a statement? Or would a better solution be to have another property identical to this one except that its data type is string? Or if a URL data type is planned to be added, is it best to wait until it's available? Silver hr (talk) 23:27, 10 March 2013 (UTC)

Yes, the way we will use source is still rather unclear. Most webpages would not be acceptable items under wd:Notability, but in most cases, they would not be very good sources either. I think one possibility will be: add the website as the property value (when it is notable enough to be an item), and the exact URL as a qualifier. --Zolo (talk) 07:24, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

I think there are legitimate cases for sourcing with webpages. I can show you an example. In Q6153452, there is a statement that the owner is Wyndham Worldwide. I think a source of sufficient authority for this statement is Wyndham's website, but I'm not sure how much sense it makes for it to be an item. If I'm interpreting the m:Wikidata/Data model correctly, there should be an IRI datatype which could, when implemented, be used in a source property, right? Silver hr (talk) 15:25, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

Yes, it seems likely that we will need a differnt datatype for such cases, and an IRI datatype is foressen. Another possibility is that we wil not use this property at all, I really dont know. --Zolo (talk) 16:55, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

merge this property with Property:P92

A discussion about merging this property with P92 (legally estahblished by) is running there Snipre (talk) 09:31, 30 March 2013 (UTC)

Receiving Warning on P248

Today, I have started getting this error message when setting a reference 'stated in': "An error occurred while saving. Your changes could not be completed. Details Warning: Use imported from (P143) instead."

First off, I think that it would be a mistake to deprecate this property (P248) in favor of P143. As far as I can tell, discussions for the last two years have clearly indicated that there is a semantical difference between those two. There are reasons for retaining both properties.

Secondly, if P248 should be deprecated, where is the discussion around this? At least there should have been a reference to such a discussion from this Talk page.

To top it all off, on Property talk:P143 (and Wikidata:Requests_for_comment/Sourcing_requirements_for_bots) there's previously been discussions regarding deprecating P143 (not P248).

So I really see no valid reason for the error message that I am getting today. At the very least, this should have been discussed thoroughly (and if it has been, it should have been referenced here). Fred Johansen (talk) 13:02, 1 February 2015 (UTC)

I have also seen the message on occasions, then spent a good hour trying to find a latest guide and failing. To me, I feel that P143 (imported) is for bots and P248 (stated) is for humans. P143 has been blindly copied, P248 has some thought behind it. Periglio (talk) 02:02, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

"Stated in" vs "source of declaration" labels

The property clearly need the "source of declaration" label. The example used in the description is Richard III of England:

 place of death: Bosworth field
   reference:
     P248: Polydore Virgil

So because "stated in": "Polydore Virgil" makes no sense, the appropriate label is "source of information". That's valid for all languages that use "stated in" translations. I know that there were edits that tried to change that but they are of course not legit. --Ogoorcs (talk) 18:18, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

This reference qualifier is supposed to be used with work items as values, not humans or organizations. Seems you’re looking for another reference claim, but please do not touch this one with 26M uses before consensus about changes has been reached. —MisterSynergy (talk) 19:55, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

• For your sample, the value should probably be "Anglica Historia" not the item for its author. --- Jura 19:58, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

The example above in this page report a human as 'source of information' and that seems correct to me.

Even the description explicitly says

   to be used in the references field to refer to the information source in which a claim is made; for qualifiers use P805

There are no indications whatsoever that this property should only be used for works. A property for other items would be redundant and useless. Further, there are lot of statements whose reference urls have 'source of informations' who are notable entities that with a works only restriction wouldn't have any other statements. You can see two example in the property page: references taken from microsoft website and the statement by Polydore Virgil (the fact that the statement was in 'Anglica Historia' does not exclude the case of public available statements not actually present in a 'work', like the ones on Microsoft website).

Also you have to note that it's your usage that is not the 'default' one, not mine. --Ogoorcs (talk) 20:12, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

We don't allow original research. A statement by a person needs to materialize in some form to be added to Wikidata. --- Jura 20:18, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

I never said that; also, in the context of software version statements, the signature of the software author and thus its official website is probably the MOST valid reference for the statement and that not constitute original research. Also statements automatically inferred from other wikidata statements are not original research, when the inference is itself referred.

In the case of a reference containing a link to a state organization (that is indeed valid), the ref could not point to a precise 'work'. Despite this, that organization is a valid 'source of information'. --Ogoorcs (talk) 20:32, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Something that is published by an organization is an „is a valid 'source of information'“. No the organization itself. --Succu (talk) 20:36, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

• The property just indicates where the same statement can be found. Help:Sources attempts to explain how various forms are included and which properties to use. If there are cases that aren't covered, maybe this needs a new property. BTW, in the meantime, I made a few items about works for Polydore Vergil. Seems we didn't have any. --- Jura 20:43, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

So should publisher (P123) or author (P50) and not 'source of information' be used to describe valid references that point to urls that are not works and that belong to humans or organizations?

EDIT: in the case of a state agency or university, if publisher is limited to 'book, periodicals, games and software', should author be used? --Ogoorcs (talk) 20:58, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Use the publication (Q732577) not related stuff. --Succu (talk) 21:09, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Sorry, can you rephrase? @Jura1: @Succu: @MisterSynergy:--Ogoorcs (talk) 21:27, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Value constraint

Can we change the <instance of> relation to <instance or subclass of>? Currently <stated in> Companies House (Q257303) throws a constraint violation because Companies House is an instance of “company register” which is a subclass of “Information” (a valid value for <stated in>). - PKM (talk) 23:50, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Just for the record, I understand this has been changed a few days later; see here. --Diegodlh (talk) 21:29, 23 September 2020 (UTC)

Links to SPARQL queries seem wrong

This property has an "as references" scope constraint. However, links to SPARQL queries in this talk page seem wrong, as they seem to be treating it as a "as main value"-constrained property.

See for example the "List of values" link at the top of the Documentation section above. Line 9 of the SPARQL query is:

?item wdt:P248 ?value

Isn't that retrieving only items which are violating the constraint? That is, items which use the property as an "as main value"-scoped property? I am a Wikidata beginner, so maybe I'm getting something wrong. Thanks! --Diegodlh (talk) 21:58, 23 September 2020 (UTC)

So How would one search for references where "stated in=some publication/something"? Get all references with "stated in=anything" (not "stated in=Q123"):

SELECT ?ref ?statedin
WHERE {
 ?ref prov:wasDerivedFrom ?a .
 ?a pr:P248 ?statedin
 # ?statedin wdt:P248 wd:Q123
} LIMIT 5

--2601:281:D87E:D6E0:A43:2FE4:251A:4D11 14:45, 15 January 2024 (UTC)

Organization as value type?

It seems value type constraint has become pretty much useless ever since national library was added as valid value type about year ago (Special:Diff/973587822). Now several organization classes are listed, as opposed to original "work", "database" and alike as value types. I think library isn't an actual source where something is stated in, and rather the actual publication (may be available in some library) should be given as "stated in" value. Similarly, I'd expect other organizations to be linked using publisher (P123) or some other more appropriate property. 2001:7D0:81F7:B580:9587:D3CB:74EF:6AF3 18:26, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

• Agree. --- Jura 10:34, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Please explain the processing

@Jura1: I'm a little surprised because of your massive editing of the property restrictions. It is primarily about this processing. Can you please explain why you did it. In any case, there was no discussion here on the discussion page. --Gymnicus (talk) 10:25, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

• Help:Sources explains how this is property used in the reference/source section of statements. I don't really see how organizations could be used there and why they were added as allowed values. Maybe this was discussed somewhere. Organizations would generally be publishers or possibly authors of publications used as values. --- Jura 10:30, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

A sports association, such as the International Bobsleigh and Skeleton Federation (Q547007), often provides information about athletes in its database, which is used here on Wikidata and also in Wikipedia. This information is therefore verified by the sports association. --Gymnicus (talk) 10:42, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

How is this relevant in terms of Help:Sources? --- Jura 10:43, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

I'd expect the value for P248 to be the item for the database you mention. International Bobsleigh and Skeleton Federation (Q547007) would probably be its publisher. --- Jura 10:59, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

@Jura1: This can probably best be explained with an example. It's about giving Matthias Guggenberger's weight. This statement requires individual evidence and the weight of the athletes is often given in the IBSF database. For this reason, for example, the weight of Matthias Guggenberger (Q331430) is verified by the IBSF. Due to your editing an error occurs there. --Gymnicus (talk) 11:08, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

mass	75 Kilogramm edit 1 reference stated in International Bobsleigh and Skeleton Federation IBSF athlete ID 129811 language of work or name English retrieved 21. January 2021 add reference
		add value

• I think it's correct that this displays as an error. International Bobsleigh and Skeleton Federation (Q547007) should be used with publisher (P123) or author (P50). Help:Sources#Databases is the relevant section. --- Jura 11:13, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

@Jura1: In point 3, however, it says that the error now displayed is incorrect. The International Bobsleigh and Skeleton Federation (Q547007) data object belongs to the property IBSF athlete ID (P2991). --Gymnicus (talk) 11:21, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

• Point 3 currently reads "link it to the database item". Q547007#P31 has different statements. A database item still needs to be created. --- Jura 11:29, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

@Jura1: No. At least in German there is talk of „Objekt zur Datenbank“ (english for "object to database"). And as you can look up on the IBSF athlete ID (P2991) property, that is the object International Bobsleigh and Skeleton Federation (Q547007). In addition, nowhere in the German version does it say that the "object to the database" must be a database. As in the case of the IBSF, the "object to the database" can in principle also be the operator. --Gymnicus (talk) 11:41, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

It's a known problem that P2991 values are suboptimalproblematic. This is why we have issued by (P2378) and applicable 'stated in' value (P9073). Q547007 is perfect as value for Property:P2991#P2378.
However none of this changes the general idea of Help:Sources. Did you note point 2? "Ensure that at least the following statement is added to the database item: instance of (P31) → database (Q8513)". --- Jura 11:59, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

It's fairly easy to fix this by bot. If you create an item for the database, you can add a request at Wikidata:Bot requests. --- Jura 12:02, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

In principle, that's not my job, it's yours. – I understand the intention behind the plan. But you should have thought better of how to implement the plan. Simply doing extensive editing and then hoping that the others will correct the mistakes is definitely not the right approach. You could have looked at them beforehand, where errors could occur and eradicated them in advance. --Gymnicus (talk) 12:15, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

I'm not saying it's your "job", it would just be nice if you would create an item for the database, so we could have them corrected eventually. While constraints have helped quite a lot getting statements right, one can't rely on them exclusively to ensure that additions are optimal. Constraint violation reports also help identify problems and correct them in bulk. Obviously, this can take some time, but generally eventually happens (BTW I don't think I added any of the incorrect statements).
Are there any open points about Help:Sources#Databases that need clarification? --- Jura 12:31, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

@Jura1: I still believe that your approach was incorrect. Just because you and the IP (in the discussion about it) were not satisfied with the current variant, you can't simply remove it without discussion, especially when so many errors occur. You are now saying that they can now be easily removed using bots. That is certainly true. But before you could have found out by means of SPARQL queries which database properties do not have an associated database object. Then you would have had the opportunity to create a database object for each of these properties. And then you would have made a bot request recommended by you and many errors had been corrected in advance. I would call that acting with foresight and that is very important in such a far-reaching process as yours. A little tip from me for you. --Gymnicus (talk) 18:22, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Well, comment about it was made nearly 2 months before value types were restored. While in the first place and not that long ago these organization classes were added without any discussion or explanation at all, which would pretty much justify restoring the status quo even without discussion. Also, the errors are there regardless of constraint. Constraint just allows users to know that things aren't quite right, as long as we don't make the constraint useless by allowing pretty much any value. 2001:7D0:81F7:B580:A99A:4B67:BEDC:A654 11:50, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

More generally, I've been wondering if it's really a good idea to display constraint warnings to all users. My impression is that average user just adds whatever class relation as long as it makes the warning go away, without caring if their "fix" actually makes sense. 2001:7D0:81F7:B580:A99A:4B67:BEDC:A654 12:00, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

Improving the model of allowed value types

As there are many allowed value types, I think it makes sense for us to create some common shared parent class which captures their shared function - something like "information source". Any ideas or objections? --SilentSpike (talk) 20:10, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

Most allowed classes are already subclasses of work (Q386724), thus they are redundant and could be removed immediately. The constraint classes which currently do not subclass work (Q386724) should be reviewed; if they cannot be made a subclass of work (Q386724), they might perhaps better be removed anyways. Relevant query: [1]. —MisterSynergy (talk) 20:38, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

@MisterSynergy: Is work not too general? For example fictional character (Q95074) is a subclass of work, but doesn't make much sense as a source. SilentSpike (talk) 20:43, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

It is not perfect, but it is effectively the gist of this constraint: we expect a *work*, not an organization, or project, or institution, or building or whatever.
I would be surprised if we could really narrow it down to a value that fits every situation, without artificially creating some class "work in the sense of P248" designed for this purpose only. —MisterSynergy (talk) 20:59, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

Two candidates that come to mind are: source of information (Q3523102) or publication (Q732577). The former would make sense since (by obvious reasoning) only a source of information can possibly be usable as a source of information. The latter would perhaps be slightly more restrictive to say that only published information should be usable as a source. SilentSpike (talk) 12:53, 25 December 2021 (UTC)

For some additional context, I'm reviewing various constraints and sourcing in Wikidata in an effort to make the constraints drive the data instead of driving the constraints with the data (i.e. while use of "work" makes the constraint effectively right given the current modelling, it makes more sense to me to make the constraint more restrictive so that errors in the modelling are revealed and should be fixed to meet the logical constraint). SilentSpike (talk) 12:56, 25 December 2021 (UTC)

Adding a new value type

@Emu: I saw that yesterday you added news agency (Q192283) as a value type. I don't fully understand this addition as it contradicts the current handling of this property. As MisterSynergy writes in section one above, the value types are supposed to be subclasses of work (Q386724). news agency (Q192283) is that not at all. So I would like to know what you were thinking when adding it. --Gymnicus (talk) 13:43, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

@Gymnicus: I did it to source Nikolaos Vernezos (Q112742832) and adding another item just for the website of Orthodoxia News Agency (Q113487152) seemed a little over the top. But feel free to undo my edit, I don’t have any strong opinion about it. --Emu (talk) 15:07, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

@Emu: I took a look at your example. In this case, wouldn't editor (P98) be the better property? --Gymnicus (talk) 16:55, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

Use as a qualifier

@Neo-Jay: Why do you want to use this property as a qualifier as well? --Gymnicus (talk) 13:51, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

I added "as qualifier" to "property scope constraint" because I think that P248 (stated in) can be used as a qualifier of P953 (full work available at URL). Is that correct? --Neo-Jay (talk) 14:09, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

@Neo-Jay: Do you have an example how you would use it? So I can imagine it better. --Gymnicus (talk) 14:27, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

For example, "The Taiwan Question and China's Reunification in the New Era" (Q113486427): statement "full work available at URL" with qualifier "stated in" and other 3 qualifiers. All the 4 qualifiers I added were later removed by KrBot and added to reference by it. I believe that this bot was wrong. But I don't want to spend my time on fighting a bot. --Neo-Jay (talk) 14:58, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

@Neo-Jay: I think instead of stated in (P248) would be published in (P1433) the right property here and in my experience the bot wouldn't intervene either. --Gymnicus (talk) 21:11, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

Any reason for property constraint (P2302) none-of constraint (Q52558054) on BBC Online (Q747860)?

BBC News Online (Q4704926) is part of BBC Online (Q747860) and would be unsuitable for large parts of BBC Online. If there are no objections then I'll remove it Piecesofuk (talk) 08:08, 6 October 2022 (UTC)

Discussion on connecting Wikidata reference properties to CS1 on Wikipedia

 You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:Module talk:Wd § References mapping. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 20:51, 7 June 2023 (UTC)