Wikidata talk:WikiProject Podcasts

Jean-Fred (talk) 22:13, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Ki7sun3 (talk) 22:15, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Battleofalma (talk) 22:36, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Husky (talk) 23:42, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Fuzheado (talk) 02:34, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Ainali (talk) 06:21, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Informatom (talk) 07:48, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Shisma (talk) 07:30, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Richard Nevell (talk) 22:59, 4 November 2019 (UTC) Nickw25 (talk) 07:54, 6 November 2019 (UTC) ElanHR (talk) 18:35, 8 November 2019 (UTC) Vahurzpu (talk) 23:31, 13 April 2020 (UTC) Matlin (talk) 09:39, 11 August 2020 (UTC) Arlo Barnes (talk) 22:50, 21 May 2021 (UTC) Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:16, 22 June 2021 (UTC) Mathieu Kappler (talk) 11:33, 6 September 2021 (UTC) Kristbaum (talk) 23:39, 24 October 2021 (UTC) Germartin1 (talk) 16:53, 3 November 2021 (UTC) RogueScholar (talk) 22:09, 14 October 2022 (UTC) Waldyrious (talk) 12:04, 1 January 2023 (UTC) Trivialist (talk) 02:35, 23 January 2023 (UTC) Maxime (talk) 08:54, 12 July 2023 (UTC) Back ache (talk) 15:33, 22 September 2023 (UTC) Egon Willighagen (talk) 16:48, 13 January 2024 (UTC) User:Jrubashk (talk) 9:50, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

Notified participants of WikiProject Podcasts

notability of podcasts

i think i created Mission Log (Q21123387) and i didn't notice when it was deleted because of a lack of notability. another item for the same podcast has been created since: Mission Log (Q65029527). aren't niche podcasts notable? --Shisma (talk) 07:39, 30 October 2019 (UTC)

Couple of observations and questions

Hey everyone, awesome that we have a project for podcasts. As a test, i tried adding every possible property to Echt Gebeurd (Q62022999), also to see if some properties might be confusing. And also to add a non-English podcast ;) Here's a couple of things i noticed:

• It seems a bit counterintuitive to add podcast (Q24634210) as instance of (P31) instead of podcast (Q20899), because the latter one has articles in every WP language. I guess this distinction is kind of the same as painting (Q3305213) versus art of painting (Q11629)? There are around 500 podcasts using podcast (Q24634210) for P31, and about 50 using podcast (Q20899). Maybe we should move those 50 over to Q24634210.[[
• I can kind of understand the distinction between production company (P272) and part of (P361), but it's still a bit confusing. For example, is NPR a publisher or are shows 'part of' NPR? We should probably clarify this better.
• Are there any sites/API's that we could scrape/query for mass imports? I was thinking of maybe using the Spotify API for a mass import.

Husky (talk) 22:53, 31 October 2019 (UTC)

As per the first question, I think migrating podcasts using podcast (Q20899) for P31 to podcast (Q24634210) makes sense to me. If we were as granular as items per episodes, that might make more sense as podcast (Q20899). Battleofalma (talk) 11:26, 1 November 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for kicking this off Husky!

First off, Wikidata:WikiProject Podcasts/Properties is, so far, me trying to document what I have been observibg ^_^'

• I think podcast (Q24634210) is quite clear about what it is (although the current English description “segment of content intended for podcasting” is not) ; while I find podcast (Q20899) a weird mix between the above and podcasting as a distribution medium and broadcasting technology (to me, it feels a bit like film (Q11424) vs cinematography (Q16144339))
• More critically: should we use P31 for that? :-) It’s its own can of worms so I’m opening a dedicated section below.
• Good question. I think this is about the distinction between the publisher (Q2085381) and the podcast network (Q24581379) − but is there really a clear distinction (Gimlet Media (Q21559828) is both? What about Radiotopia (Q22039329) − it’s a network, but also kind-of a publisher?)
• Wikidata:WikiProject Podcasts/Identifiers would be a start. There is fyyd (Q73162703), for which I just filed a property proposal (you should have gotten a ping!). But more to the point there is Panoptikum.social (Q64729537) (for which we already have Panoptikum podcast ID (P4818)) and which is developed by our very own @Informatom:. He can tell us more about his database :)

Jean-Fred (talk) 20:55, 1 November 2019 (UTC)

I have started to add individual episodes as items for two different podcasts (since the media files for them are on Commons already). Does that make a difference for this discussion? Ainali (talk) 19:46, 22 November 2019 (UTC)

Given that everybody seems to agree that we shouldn't have podcast (Q20899) as the instance of (P31), i've run a batch to remove all existing items that still had that and replaced it with instance of (P31)podcast (Q24634210). I've also created a new report to track items that still use podcast (Q20899). Husky (talk) 22:48, 24 November 2019 (UTC)

instance of (P31) vs distribution format (P437) ?

Currently we have two competing modeling − instance of (P31) and distribution format (P437). For example:

• This American Life (Q2421465)instance of (P31)radio program (Q1555508) / -distribution format (P437)audio podcast (Q24633474)
• Love and Radio (Q6691681)instance of (P31)podcast (Q24634210)

I have been tracking that for a while at Wikidata:WikiProject Podcasts/Reports/instance of and Wikidata:WikiProject Podcasts/Reports/distribution.

This really brings us to the central question of − what is a podcast? I often hear smth along the lines of “on-demand audio content to which you subscribe through RSS”¹. But after all, This American Life (Q2421465), one of the most famous 'podcasts' out there, existed well before podcasting was a thing (even before RSS was standardised). Is a podcast (such as Echt Gebeurd (Q62022999)) then just a radio program that just happens to be broadcast over RSS feeds instead of the FM band? Or is a podcast something fundamentally different from a radio program − and TAL just happens to be both?

¹ (Not talking about the fact that in the Luminary (Q73166044)-era we don’t even need [or can’t use] RSS to subscribe to podcasts).

Trying to draw parallels with other media:

• for movies & TV shows: we do have House of Cards (Q3330940)instance of (P31)television series (Q5398426), even though this was never really, stricly speaking, on "television". Many movies never hit the screens, but go direct-to-dvd or to modern streaming platforms.
• For video game, we also don’t P31 with mobile game (Q1121542)/PC game (Q4485157)/console game (Q6561427) because even if each is 'its own thing' (with WP articles to dissert about ;)), we recognise this ultimately it boils down to the same core entity, just a different distribution mechanism − and indeed, PC games get ported on consoles, and console games get remade on mobile.

Both analogies used to kind of push me towards the “podcast as a distribution format (P437)” thought ; but thinking more about it, and trying to be practical (I don’t see how we could enforce not using podcast as P31), I’ll be tempted to indeed use Love and Radio (Q6691681)instance of (P31)podcast (Q24634210), and for shows like TAL just use both. Maybe?

Thanks for reading me pontificating, and I’ll be happy to hear your thoughts :)

(Ah, and next up we’ll have podcast (Q24634210) vs audio podcast (Q24633474) & video podcast (Q3276244) ;-)

Jean-Fred (talk) 20:55, 1 November 2019 (UTC)

The distinction can be pretty vague, especially when you start looking into some radio stations that basically use podcasting as their 'on demand' solution for new audiences. For example, virtually all major radio programs produced by the Dutch public broadcaster (Stichting Nederlandse Publieke Omroep (Q15991875)) are also available on the major podcast platforms. Sometimes a series is produced mainly for use as a podcast, but is then also transmitted on linear radio later on (e.g. The fire in the country house (Q62022995)). Should you then add instance of (P31)audio podcast (Q24633474) / distribution format (P437)radio program (Q1555508)? That doesn't seem to make much sense.

One solution could be to simply allow items to have both instance of (P31)podcast (Q24634210) and instance of (P31)radio program (Q1555508). This would at make sure that items show up in both queries for podcasts and radio programs. original broadcaster (P449) should be enough to indicate that something was originally produced for a radio station. Husky (talk) 22:21, 24 November 2019 (UTC)

@Husky: Thanks for the answer (that for some reason I missed until now).

Agree that original broadcaster (P449) works well to clarify the original medium.

I think using both podcast (Q24634210) and radio program (Q1555508) as P31 for shows that hit both the RSS feeds and the FM band makes sense (whether the former was before the latter or vice-versa) − even for shows that one associates more readily with podcasting (for example 99% Invisible (Q16001236), which also goes through PRX).

What about shows that have never hit "normal"-radio − pure-internet based shows like FLOSS Weekly (Q5426552) − do you also suggest using both as P31?

Jean-Fred (talk) 09:45, 30 January 2020 (UTC)

original language of film or TV show (P364) vs language of work or name (P407)

I had literally never heard of original language of film or TV show (P364) until I compiled Wikidata:WikiProject Podcasts/Properties − most podcasts currently use language of work or name (P407). What makes the most sense for podcasts? Jean-Fred (talk) 20:58, 1 November 2019 (UTC)

(As the label was changed between me posting this and now: at the time of writing P364 was called “original language of performance work” instead of “original language of film or TV show” Jean-Fred (talk) 09:37, 5 November 2019 (UTC))

I've not seen original language of film or TV show (P364) in the wild, but since it's a subproperty of language of work or name (P407) I'd lean towards the broader property. original language of film or TV show (P364) seems suited to when a work has been translated; are there any podcasts which have been translated? Richard Nevell (talk) 22:54, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

Looks like @Jura1: went ahead and decided this was supposed to be language of work or name (P407) − fine by me. Jean-Fred (talk) 11:07, 5 November 2019 (UTC)

Sorry, I hadn't seen this before. I think Richard Nevell mentioned the main problem we have with films. --- Jura 11:10, 5 November 2019 (UTC)

inception (P571)/dissolved, abolished or demolished date (P576) vs start time (P580)/end time (P582)

@Jura1: changed inception (P571)/dissolved, abolished or demolished date (P576) into start time (P580)/end time (P582). I don’t have strong opinions either way on what is the Correct Way™, except that the example given in the table is now misleading (Limetown (Q22079695) is using inception (P571), not start time (P580)) ; and overall we have twice as many usage of inception (P571) vs start time (P580).

Should we discuss this? Jean-Fred (talk) 11:07, 5 November 2019 (UTC)

I changed it as TV series use start time/end time. --- Jura 11:08, 5 November 2019 (UTC)

contributor to the creative work or subject (P767) vs talk show guest (P5030)

Great to see this project up and running and I'll have to try out the 'cradle' to create items on episodes. It's given me some food for thought as I've been adding episodes for Speaking with Shadows (Q70345619). Each episode consists of the presentor talking to experts on a given topic. So which property would be more suitable? I've been going with contributor to the creative work or subject (P767) but now I'm not so sure. Richard Nevell (talk) 22:45, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

There is also presenter. --- Jura 11:11, 5 November 2019 (UTC)

I was working up to that! My understanding of a presenter is someone who introduces people or segments. So you might have a couple of presenters as well as the guests. Should they be listed as contributor to the creative work or subject (P767)? Richard Nevell (talk) 22:46, 5 November 2019 (UTC)

@Richard Nevell: I think I lean towards talk show guest (P5030) ; contributor to the creative work or subject (P767) feels to me both more 'generic' (what you’d use if you can’t use author or producer or else) and more "out-work" (like producer etc.) rather than "in-work" (like presenter) (although I agree that might be an artificial division). Jean-Fred (talk) 09:54, 22 November 2019 (UTC)

Jean-Frédéric Going for the more specific option sounds sensible. Richard Nevell (talk) 22:52, 25 November 2019 (UTC)

Model items

Do we have any candidates for model items? If not we should probably try to carve out some for items that are podcast (Q24634210), podcast episode (Q61855877) and podcast series season (Q69154911). That will probably make us working more efficiently (and also identify pain points). Ainali (talk) 19:54, 22 November 2019 (UTC)

I've made a list with all podcasts sorted by number of statements. Maybe not the best measure (because some have many items for a single claim) but at least it gives a bit of an idea. Based on that list i would say Chapo Trap House (Q26963078) is pretty good. I've also tried to give Echt Gebeurd (Q62022999) as many properties as described on our list. Husky (talk) 22:34, 24 November 2019 (UTC)

Husky Both those items look in good shape, but they'd need more references to become model items. Is there a way to tweak the query to list items with most referenced statements? Richard Nevell (talk) 23:00, 25 November 2019 (UTC)

Husky I think you are referring to Showcase items, model items don't need references. Ainali (talk) 19:05, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

Don't hesitate to replace the one I added. Q26963078 might not be ideal as it has 3 values in P31 and I'm not convinced they are all compatible. --- Jura 23:15, 25 November 2019 (UTC)

Transcriptions

Is there a property for episode transcripts? I've used described at URL (P973) a handful of times but it doesn't seem adequate. Richard Nevell (talk) 21:10, 28 January 2020 (UTC)

@Richard Nevell: Good question! How about full work available at URL (P953)? Maybe combined with a qualifier applies to part (P518) or object has role (P3831) to transcript (Q17142652). I see that a couple of Star Trek episodes used this combination for transcripts, e.g. Spock's Brain (Q3488820). Husky (talk) 22:11, 28 January 2020 (UTC)

I like the idea of full work available at URL (P953) with a qualifier applies to part (P518) to transcript (Q17142652). Ainali (talk) 09:55, 29 January 2020 (UTC)

Sounds good to me as well. Jean-Fred (talk) 10:38, 29 January 2020 (UTC)

I was creating an example entry (The Roman Mars Mazda Virus (Q83966430)), then i realised there is one catch with this way to model transcripts. I guess that most episodes that have a transcript available will probably host it at the same URL as the 'episode page'. There might be episodes that host the transcript at a different URL than the episode, but i wonder if having the same URL for both is not the majority. Does it make a lot of sense to use the qualifier then? Husky (talk) 15:30, 29 January 2020 (UTC)

Hmmm, but if we want to query for podcast episodes with/without transcripts, we need to model it somehow. All/most podcasts will have their audio available (by definition! :-), but not so many have a transcript available.

Also, I actually wonder about using full work available at URL (P953) with this URL. Sure, there is a play button there, but the actual “work” (as in, the audio file), is actually there − in the same way that the play button in this DB entry or that one is also just a pointer to that MP3 file.

So how about:

⟨ - ⟩ full work available at URL (P953) ⟨ https://traffic.megaphone.fm/GLT8937432626.mp3 ⟩
applies to part (P518) ⟨ audio file (Q26987229)    ⟩
file format (P2701) ⟨ MP3 (Q42591)    ⟩

⟨ - ⟩ full work available at URL (P953) ⟨ https://gimletmedia.com/shows/reply-all/brh8jm ⟩
applies to part (P518) ⟨ transcript (Q17142652)    ⟩

⟨ - ⟩ official website (P856) ⟨ https://gimletmedia.com/shows/reply-all/brh8jm ⟩

(Potentially dropping the -applies to part (P518)audio file (Q26987229) − if we consider that the “work” is the audio file − then there is no “part of” to speak of?

Jean-Fred (talk) 16:52, 29 January 2020 (UTC)

That sounds like a good way of organising it, so I'll apply it to the items I've created. Richard Nevell (talk) 09:26, 11 April 2020 (UTC)

Yes, that seems solid. I think we can drop the -applies to part (P518)audio file (Q26987229) along your thoughts Jean-Fred. Should we add fileformat to the transcript perhaps? Like:

⟨ - ⟩ full work available at URL (P953) ⟨ https://gimletmedia.com/shows/reply-all/brh8jm ⟩
applies to part (P518) ⟨ transcript (Q17142652)    ⟩
file format (P2701) ⟨ HyperText Markup Language (Q62626012)    ⟩

Ainali (talk) 11:24, 13 April 2020 (UTC)

Agree with adding file format (P2701) Jean-Fred (talk) 13:47, 23 September 2020 (UTC)

Belatedly, I have documented this consensus at Wikidata:WikiProject_Podcasts/Properties#Properties_for_podcast_episodes. Jean-Fred (talk) 13:47, 23 September 2020 (UTC)

Spotify show ID (P5916)

Anyone got an idea why all the Wikidata property example (P1855) are dead? --Trade (talk) 14:08, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

The one for Reply Al (Q20022710) still works for me? Jean-Fred (talk) 13:00, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

Linking a show to its network

Right now, the practice is to use part of (P361) − eg Love and Radio (Q6691681)part of (P361)Radiotopia (Q22039329).

I was wondering, would it make more sense to rather use member of (P463)?

Jean-Fred (talk) 13:49, 23 September 2020 (UTC)

Really good question. How do the networks talk about the shows themselves? That could be useful input. Ainali (talk) 18:37, 14 October 2020 (UTC)

That’s what tipped me − the Radiotopia shows I listen to definitely say “99% invisible/Song Exploder is a proud member of Radiotopia (Q22039329)”. Conversely, Play;Write (Q99541673) is “A proud part of the Cane and Rinse network (Q99541645).”

I think there is also an actual modeling question: I think that part of (P361) implies that the total does not exist without the part, and that the part only exists as part of the total. However, as exemplified by en:Radiotopia#Timeline_of_shows, the podcast shows may join and drop-out of a network. In that context, I feel that member of (P463) (with the relevant start/end time qualifiers, if applicable) is a better fit?

That’s my understanding, however this seems contradicted by some of the examples at Help:Basic_membership_properties…

Jean-Fred (talk) 09:35, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

You make a very good case. And I have heard it used by the Twit network as well now that I think of it. And some of the examples on that help page should be updated, since they are not the best ones. Let's go with P463. Ainali (talk) 18:59, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Modeling editors using film editor (P1040)?

Podcasts often have an “editor” − someone who “cuts the (now metaphorical) tape”.

This is not in the sense of editor (P98) or editor-in-chief (P5769). There sometimes is some language overlap with “producer” − Definitions seem to be a bit fuzzy − but I listen to podcasts which clearly make the distinction between the two, so I’d rather not use producer (P162).

I suggest extending film editor (P1040) for this, does that sound reasonable?

Jean-Fred (talk) 09:08, 14 October 2020 (UTC)

That sounds both reasonable and useful. I noticed last week that one Swedish podcast award even had a category for best editor so they do get recognition. Ainali (talk) 18:29, 14 October 2020 (UTC)

Property proposals

Just a heads-up that there's currently a batch of 9 podcast identifier property proposals currently open at Wikidata:Property proposal/Authority control. Vahurzpu (talk) 22:16, 21 December 2020 (UTC)

Listing them here for convenience:

• Wikidata:Property proposal/PodBean show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/Libsyn show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/Player.fm show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/RadioPublic show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/TuneIn Podcasts show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/Radio.com Podcasts show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/Podcast Addict show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/Pocket Casts show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/Stitcher show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/Castbox show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/Podtail show ID
• Wikidata:Property proposal/The Podcast App show ID

(I think I pinged on each one as well).

Jean-Fred (talk) 07:24, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

Most of these were just approved and created, and the remaining ones look like they will be soon. The next step would seem to be doing mass imports to put the new properties into use. Is there anyone who knows how interested in taking that on? {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 02:37, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

Are you suggesting importing their entire catalogs creating new items for every show they have, or rather match existing items of shows to these IDs? Ainali (talk) 07:16, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

And indeed, Wikidata:WikiProject Podcasts/Identifiers doubled in length ^_^

Sdkb, depends what you want to do. If it’s about the matching, then a good first step is to add the catalog to toolforge:mix-n-match − see the 'Podcasts' group there ; however for that you generally need to either have a full dump, an API, or that the website can be web-scraped − I had a quick look and it looks to me that none of these websites lend themselves to that exercise… Jean-Fred (talk) 10:09, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

Difference

Are there any real difference between podcast directory (Q24579448) and podcast hosting service (Q61715186)? --Trade (talk) 17:09, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

Yes. A podcast is usually only hosted in one podcast hosting service (Q61715186) (where the files and the RSS feed is) but is listed in several podcast directory (Q24579448) (which may subscribe to the RSS-feed, but might just point to the host) Ainali (talk) 07:20, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

Bot update number of episodes (P1113)?

I noticed that for example 99% Invisible (Q16001236) have a web feed URL (P1019) and in the feed there is a tag <itunes:episode>425</itunes:episode>. In theory, it should be possible to update number of episodes (P1113) with a bot that listens to all the feeds. Is it a good idea? That would probably mean weekly updates on many podcasts. Ainali (talk) 16:08, 10 January 2021 (UTC)

This is a really good find! So far I have been counting the episodes in the feeds but annoyingly have found some only list the last few episodes so if this data is available in a feed, I will look to regarding it as the ultimate source of truth. Back ache (talk) 08:41, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

👍 Cool idea Shisma (talk) 17:37, 10 January 2021 (UTC)

podcast genre (Q104822033)

Most podcast directories sorts podcasts after genre so i decided WD could followed the same principle. Thoughts? --Trade (talk) 08:08, 19 January 2021 (UTC)

What has this to do with Q12199212 ? Jean-Fred (talk) 09:12, 19 January 2021 (UTC)

Trade Yes, it is already modelled with genre (P136) Wikidata:WikiProject_Podcasts/Properties#Properties_for_podcasts/podcast_shows. Ainali (talk) 19:09, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

@Jean-Frédéric:, fixed--Trade (talk) 19:12, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

Radio show vs podcast

Would anyone mind if i split these items? Just because a podcast of a radio show have an X number of episodes, it does not mean that the same applies to the show itself.

Jean-Fred (talk) 22:13, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Ki7sun3 (talk) 22:15, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Battleofalma (talk) 22:36, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Husky (talk) 23:42, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Fuzheado (talk) 02:34, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Ainali (talk) 06:21, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Informatom (talk) 07:48, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Shisma (talk) 07:30, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Richard Nevell (talk) 22:59, 4 November 2019 (UTC) Nickw25 (talk) 07:54, 6 November 2019 (UTC) ElanHR (talk) 18:35, 8 November 2019 (UTC) Vahurzpu (talk) 23:31, 13 April 2020 (UTC) Matlin (talk) 09:39, 11 August 2020 (UTC) Arlo Barnes (talk) 22:50, 21 May 2021 (UTC) Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:16, 22 June 2021 (UTC) Mathieu Kappler (talk) 11:33, 6 September 2021 (UTC) Kristbaum (talk) 23:39, 24 October 2021 (UTC) Germartin1 (talk) 16:53, 3 November 2021 (UTC) RogueScholar (talk) 22:09, 14 October 2022 (UTC) Waldyrious (talk) 12:04, 1 January 2023 (UTC) Trivialist (talk) 02:35, 23 January 2023 (UTC) Maxime (talk) 08:54, 12 July 2023 (UTC) Back ache (talk) 15:33, 22 September 2023 (UTC) Egon Willighagen (talk) 16:48, 13 January 2024 (UTC) User:Jrubashk (talk) 9:50, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

Notified participants of WikiProject Podcasts --Trade (talk) 07:54, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

Can you link the items() in question? Ainali (talk) 11:28, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

• The Ricky Gervais Show (Q23820)

If you look at instance of (P31) of podcast (Q24634210), there are basically hundreds of items like this. @Ainali:--Trade (talk) 10:38, 4 May 2021 (UTC)

Ah, I see. I thought you wanted to split perhaps Q24634210. But yes, I agree that the radioshow and the podcast versions could split into separate items. They may have separate identifiers, URLs, lengths etc. Ainali (talk) 19:33, 4 May 2021 (UTC)

Can you help me fix the PodBean URL on For and About Asperger's (Q104604543)? --Trade (talk) 10:49, 10 May 2021 (UTC)

Requiring qualifier

This is an error, right?

Property_talk:P9010#Requiring_qualifier

Only this property is requiring such a thing of all the podcast properties I see. Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:00, 28 July 2021 (UTC)

Some podcasts are markwd as "explicit". See You Can [Not] Podcast (Q106588650) as an example --Trade (talk) 00:23, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

@Bluerasberry:--Trade (talk) 00:27, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

@Trade: Okay, I see at player.fm they are applying an "explicit" label to this podcast. In Wikidata it seems that the identifier for player.fm requires has characteristic (P1552) as qualifier on the identifier itself. I expected the label to apply to the podcast itself, though, and not to the identifier.

If podcasts are the same show syndicated to multiple publishers, then is "explicit" not a general quality? Thanks. Blue Rasberry (talk) 12:19, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

The "explicit" is specific to the individual directory rather than intrinsic the podcast itself. For all we know it might mean different things on different sites.

The quality are not limited to syndicated podcasts. It's likely just aomething you mark when you submit it @Bluerasberry:--Trade (talk) 13:25, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

 Resolved All that makes sense, got it, the way this is set up is the way it should be. Blue Rasberry (talk) 15:55, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

Country of Origin

The hosts of Radio GDR (Q108534624) are from Germany, the UK and the United States. How do we determine the country of origin?

Jean-Fred (talk) 22:13, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Ki7sun3 (talk) 22:15, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Battleofalma (talk) 22:36, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Husky (talk) 23:42, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Fuzheado (talk) 02:34, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Ainali (talk) 06:21, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Informatom (talk) 07:48, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Shisma (talk) 07:30, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Richard Nevell (talk) 22:59, 4 November 2019 (UTC) Nickw25 (talk) 07:54, 6 November 2019 (UTC) ElanHR (talk) 18:35, 8 November 2019 (UTC) Vahurzpu (talk) 23:31, 13 April 2020 (UTC) Matlin (talk) 09:39, 11 August 2020 (UTC) Arlo Barnes (talk) 22:50, 21 May 2021 (UTC) Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:16, 22 June 2021 (UTC) Mathieu Kappler (talk) 11:33, 6 September 2021 (UTC) Kristbaum (talk) 23:39, 24 October 2021 (UTC) Germartin1 (talk) 16:53, 3 November 2021 (UTC) RogueScholar (talk) 22:09, 14 October 2022 (UTC) Waldyrious (talk) 12:04, 1 January 2023 (UTC) Trivialist (talk) 02:35, 23 January 2023 (UTC) Maxime (talk) 08:54, 12 July 2023 (UTC) Back ache (talk) 15:33, 22 September 2023 (UTC) Egon Willighagen (talk) 16:48, 13 January 2024 (UTC) User:Jrubashk (talk) 9:50, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

Notified participants of WikiProject Podcasts --Trade (talk) 21:24, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

@Trade: This appears to be a smaller amateur podcast from the description at https://radiogdr.com/about/. I think we should list all host countries for such cases. This item should have 3 countries of origin. Blue Rasberry (talk) 21:47, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

I would choose the country where it's produced, recorded Germartin1 (talk) 16:54, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

Telegram Group

Jean-Fred (talk) 22:13, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Ki7sun3 (talk) 22:15, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Battleofalma (talk) 22:36, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Husky (talk) 23:42, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Fuzheado (talk) 02:34, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Ainali (talk) 06:21, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Informatom (talk) 07:48, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Shisma (talk) 07:30, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Richard Nevell (talk) 22:59, 4 November 2019 (UTC) Nickw25 (talk) 07:54, 6 November 2019 (UTC) ElanHR (talk) 18:35, 8 November 2019 (UTC) Vahurzpu (talk) 23:31, 13 April 2020 (UTC) Matlin (talk) 09:39, 11 August 2020 (UTC) Arlo Barnes (talk) 22:50, 21 May 2021 (UTC) Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:16, 22 June 2021 (UTC) Mathieu Kappler (talk) 11:33, 6 September 2021 (UTC) Kristbaum (talk) 23:39, 24 October 2021 (UTC) Germartin1 (talk) 16:53, 3 November 2021 (UTC) RogueScholar (talk) 22:09, 14 October 2022 (UTC) Waldyrious (talk) 12:04, 1 January 2023 (UTC) Trivialist (talk) 02:35, 23 January 2023 (UTC) Maxime (talk) 08:54, 12 July 2023 (UTC) Back ache (talk) 15:33, 22 September 2023 (UTC) Egon Willighagen (talk) 16:48, 13 January 2024 (UTC) User:Jrubashk (talk) 9:50, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

Notified participants of WikiProject Podcasts

I've made a telegram group. Everyone is welcome to join

https://t.me/joinchat/ZkGPn9VR9FgwNGEy

Germartin1 (talk) 15:28, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

add a youtube channel as a property

I have seen youtube starting to be used as a distribution platform for podcasts, for example "fully charged" using a playlist https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLU-GRnq4BD0oo6GSmLB3K3xWjK8arjqMw

Should we add that as an additional property? I feel if they are doing it with an automated tool (so that it is delvivered as to other platforms at the same time) it should be a yes, but if they are doing in manually and therefore may get out of sync, the answer should be "maybe" Back ache (talk) 11:24, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Property for interview guest?

For lots of media, including podcasts, news broadcasts, journalism, and research reports, it often happens that the author, host, or presenter interviewers someone.

I think there is no Wikidata property for "guest", is there?

Many podcasts are talk shows where a host interviews a guest. Do we have a property for that? If not then I might propose one.

Thoughts? Thanks. Bluerasberry (talk) 19:11, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

@Bluerasberry: We have talk show guest (P5030), which seems to be what you're looking for. I've used it for interviews generally, even if they're not talk show guests per se (i.e. if the media in question isn't a talk show), but I think this is a reasonable and unambiguous extension. Vahurzpu (talk) 01:47, 2 July 2022 (UTC)

@Bluerasberry: We discussed this above at #contributor_to_the_creative_work_or_subject_(P767)_vs_talk_show_guest_(P5030). As Vahurzpu says, talk show guest (P5030) is the current modelling − I also agree that while podcasts are not talk shows, it works fine. That usage is documented at Wikidata:WikiProject_Podcasts/Properties#Properties_for_podcast_episodes.

See also the Wikidata:Property_proposal/onscreen_participant proposal, which could be a super-property of what you’re looking for.

Jean-Fred (talk) 08:50, 3 July 2022 (UTC)

Which property should I use for episode numbers of podcast episodes?

Some podcasts set episode numbers for their podcast episodes. For example,

• The Stack Overflow Podcast (Q109341126) show episode numbers for its episodes in its official wbesite
• The Joe Rogan Experience (Q30323986) show episode numbers for its episodes in its Spotify profile

I'm now wondering which Wikidata property I should use in a podcast episode to store its episode number.

(please ping on reply) Rdrg109 (talk) 19:46, 17 July 2022 (UTC)

@Rdrg109: I would say series ordinal (P1545) as qualifier to either season (P4908) (if there are seasons) and/or to part of the series (P179) (for the absolute number), what do you think?

if that’s fine, I will document it on Wikidata:WikiProject_Podcasts/Properties.

Jean-Fred (talk) 21:22, 17 July 2022 (UTC)

I would use "production code" for a number a human has picked and "series ordinal" for its absolute position in the timeline, this is because episode numbers humans come up with can be different because for example they may have a "special" they consider to be outside of the episodic timeline. You'll see this in this list of episodes for exmaple https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Talk%3AQ109248984 Back ache (talk) 08:56, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

Claim that Apple uses Wikipedia and Wikidata for podcast topic taggin

https://podnews.net/update/apple-podcasts-tagging

Anyone know anything about this? Bluerasberry (talk) 22:35, 23 November 2022 (UTC)

Seems legit! I wish the author was more explicit about showing the result, but I did a bit of digging into the podcast and indeed the metadata in the HTML has Wikipedia articles and Wikidata Q numbers. Step-by-step:

• Original post is here: https://wearebumper.com/blog/2022/11/15/apple-episode-topics/
• Here is the Apple podcast episode page that author describes: https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/is-putins-war-in-ukraine-at-a-turning-point/id932499233?i=1000582504945
• Using any web browser with web developer tools, you can inspect the code and look for "wiki." On Chrome this would be View->Developer->Inspect elements.
• Inspect the DOM element <script type="fastboot/shoebox" id="shoebox-media-api-cache-amp-podcasts">
• You should see lots of wiki related metadata. I've pasted the full code block into this snippet: https://gitlab.wikimedia.org/-/snippets/52/raw/main/snippetfile1.txt
• Here is a dump of the "topics" data structure with the wiki elements of interest:

{\"relevance\":0.9619269967079163,\"name\":\"Vladimir Putin\",\"wikiUrl\":\"https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Putin\",\"wikiQid\":\"Q7747\"},

{\"relevance\":0.9603449702262878,\"name\":\"Ukraine\",\"wikiUrl\":\"https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine\",\"wikiQid\":\"Q212\"},

{\"relevance\":0.9050624966621399,\"name\":\"Russia\",\"wikiUrl\":\"https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia\",\"wikiQid\":\"Q159\"},

Pretty cool. The "relevance" rating seems like a confidence factor typical of machine learning/AI classification systems. - Fuzheado (talk) 16:09, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

Merge tables of identifier properties?

There are currently two tables listing external identifier properties for this project: /Properties § Identifiers and /Identifiers.

At the time of writing, the latter contains 8 items that the former doesn't (TheTVDB episode ID (P7043), Panoptikum podcast episode ID (P7849), fyyd podcast episode ID (P7857), Podchaser creator ID (P9743), Spotify show episode ID (P9882), Podchaser numeric creator ID (P10289), Apple Podcasts episode ID (P10304), Podchaser episode ID (P10458)).

Is there a reason these tables are maintained separately? Could they be merged, or at least could we find a way to keep them automatically in sync? --Waldyrious (talk) 12:39, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

Update: there's not yet another identifier that should be automatically picked up by /Identifiers and not by /Properties § Identifiers: PodLink ID (P11468). --Waldyrious (talk) 15:09, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

Jean-Fred (talk) 22:13, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Ki7sun3 (talk) 22:15, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Battleofalma (talk) 22:36, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Husky (talk) 23:42, 29 October 2019 (UTC) Fuzheado (talk) 02:34, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Ainali (talk) 06:21, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Informatom (talk) 07:48, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Shisma (talk) 07:30, 30 October 2019 (UTC) Richard Nevell (talk) 22:59, 4 November 2019 (UTC) Nickw25 (talk) 07:54, 6 November 2019 (UTC) ElanHR (talk) 18:35, 8 November 2019 (UTC) Vahurzpu (talk) 23:31, 13 April 2020 (UTC) Matlin (talk) 09:39, 11 August 2020 (UTC) Arlo Barnes (talk) 22:50, 21 May 2021 (UTC) Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:16, 22 June 2021 (UTC) Mathieu Kappler (talk) 11:33, 6 September 2021 (UTC) Kristbaum (talk) 23:39, 24 October 2021 (UTC) Germartin1 (talk) 16:53, 3 November 2021 (UTC) RogueScholar (talk) 22:09, 14 October 2022 (UTC) Waldyrious (talk) 12:04, 1 January 2023 (UTC) Trivialist (talk) 02:35, 23 January 2023 (UTC) Maxime (talk) 08:54, 12 July 2023 (UTC) Back ache (talk) 15:33, 22 September 2023 (UTC) Egon Willighagen (talk) 16:48, 13 January 2024 (UTC) User:Jrubashk (talk) 9:50, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

Notified participants of WikiProject Podcasts. --Waldyrious (talk) 15:13, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

I think we should merge them and only have one. It's probably better to use the subpage so that one can be transcluded where needed. Ainali (talk) 15:51, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

The differences (as I see them) are:

• /Properties § Identifiers
  • Manually populated/curated
  • Organized by domain (one section for identifiers for shows, another section for episodes, another for creators)
  • Purpose of data-model documentation ("I’m editing podcasts, what should I use").
• /Identifiers
  • automatically populated (Listeria-based)
  • fairly indiscriminate (lists all properties that are p279 of Wikidata property related to podcasts (Q67198839))
  • purpose of statistics and 'dashboard'

So I see them as complementary, rather than redundant.

As for why some properties are not in the first − well that’s because it’s manual, and it’s just not been updated. But another way to look at it is that it’s a curated list, and that all properties do not need to be listed there (I mirrored these lists from WikiProject Video games, where adding all hundreds of identifiers to the data-model documentation would be overwhelming)

Hope that helps, Jean-Fred (talk) 21:23, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

That does help, thanks! However, considering that we do have Wikidata property to identify podcasts (Q84612171) and Wikidata property to identify podcast episodes (Q84574746), I believe we could create a third item for "Wikidata property to identify podcast creator", and then set up Listeria to create the domain-specific tables — plus one to catch any identifiers that aren't instances of any of those three categories, which either should be or signal an additional category that might need to be created. WDYT? Waldyrious (talk) 09:04, 17 January 2023 (UTC)

Pinging @Ainali and @Jean-Fred so this discussion doesn't get stale :) --Waldyrious (talk) 18:50, 18 March 2023 (UTC)

New podcast id properties?

Q: I noticed there aren't actual wikidata properties for these yet: (with respective examples)

https://podcastindex.org/

https://podcastindex.org/podcast/5928027

https://castro.fm/

https://castro.fm/itunes/1660959088

https://overcast.fm/

https://overcast.fm/itunes1660959088 (I'm confused about this one. Seems like they just use Itunes id's?)

https://goodpods.com/

https://www.goodpods.com/podcasts-aid/1660959088

https://podfriend.com/

https://web.podfriend.com/podcast/1660959088

Could someone create these? Thibaultmol (talk) 16:22, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Podfriend and goodpods just seem to use itunes IDs? If so we can add them as third-party formatter URL (P3303) to Apple Podcasts podcast ID (P5842) (overcast is already there too). Jean-Fred (talk) 16:33, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Oh yeah you're right. I've added them. Same with Castro.

So podcast index needs to be created then still Thibaultmol (talk) 18:02, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

I've created the property proposal at Wikidata:Property proposal/Podcast Index ID. --Waldyrious (talk) 19:28, 18 March 2023 (UTC)

It was succcessful and is https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P11740 Back ache (talk) 09:16, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

Are Audible Originals really podcasts?

I'm seeing a lot more of these showing up lately and I think they raise some quasi-fundamental taxonomic issues that would benefit from consensus. I'll start off by acknowledging my bias, which is that I don't believe these are even remotely related to podcasts as they're widely known and only labelled as such because consumers are familiar with the term as synonymous for on-demand episodic audio. I also happen to hold fast to the belief that Spotify Originals also fail to satisfy the definition of a podcast, but one thing at a time.

I think we need to find a value other than podcast (Q20899) to supply to instance of (P31) for these Audible Plus productions because they:

• Are not published publicly as an XML feed that can be ingested by an RSS reader or podcatcher
• Cannot be downloaded as a commonly formatted audio file, even after purchase
• Do not receive any of even the most ubiquitous external identifiers such as an Apple Podcasts podcast ID (P5842) or a Podchaser podcast ID (P7998)

These would seem to actually be more closely related to theatre productions in that they entail paying a "box office" ticket price in order to join the audience, distributor's rights are strictly enforced (digitally) to prevent recordings being made/distributed of the performance and the "venue" for listening is limited in order to inflate their value. None of this bears any resemblance to what I know as a podcast after a decade of broad consumption of the format. However, I'm only one (rather opinionated) person and I can accept that my perception of reality may differ wildly from that of others, hence I put this question to you, my fellow Wikidatans. 🐈⚞ℛogueScholar⚟^{🗨₨UserTalk} 03:01, 4 August 2023 (UTC)

GUID

I have come across an idea to give each podcast a unique ID by an organisation started in 2020 called podcastnamespace.org

https://podcastnamespace.org/tag/guid

They also creating their own namespace and tag to be independent of apples, what are you thoughts?

If we were to import their GUID's what property would you use? Back ache (talk) 09:51, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

I would propose a new External Identifier property “podcastnamespace ID”. Jean-Fred (talk) 11:27, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

Languages

Just in case you notice me adding to few records, I would like to make it easier to find non-english content so have been going through any podcast that do not have their language registered, extracting that info from their feed, then adding it.

Whilst I am at it I am counting the number of episodes in their feed and if it has increased am adding that too.

The way I am doing it is quite crude and will only catch some languages but hopefully it'll help Back ache (talk) 10:54, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

Panelists of a roundtable podcast

Hello,

(this somewhat follows-up on #contributor_to_the_creative_work_or_subject_(P767)_vs_talk_show_guest_(P5030)).

I have been planning to create items for the Cane and Rinse (Q99541669) podcast. It’s a roundtable podcast where (usually) 4 panelists (from a roster of a dozen or so I guess) discuss a game. For each episode, one of the panelists also has the role of "host" (bit more active in steering the discussion etc.) I want to model that information, and I am not too sure how.

• as for the panelists:
  • I was initially going for talk show guest (P5030), but thinking more about it that seems more specifically for "one-time guests", while the podcast panelists are more like "staff members".
  • there’s contributor to the creative work or subject (P767), but per the previous discussion that’s more for "external" contributions (who helped make the show).
  • finally we have recorded participant (P11108) − somewhat generic, but perhaps the best fit?
• as for the host seems
  • presenter (P371) is a good fit ; but thinking more about it the job of the host is not that different from the other panelists − should it then also be recorder as a panelist (as modelled above)?

Alternatively, we do not use two different properties − throw all panelists in one property, and qualify the host with object has role (P3831)=program host (Q94498772) ?

Happy to hear your thoughts :) Jean-Fred (talk) 08:15, 5 September 2023 (UTC)

Thinking more about it, I am leaning towards

presenter (P371)	Alice edit 0 references add reference Bob edit object has role program host 0 references add reference Charlie edit 0 references add reference
		add value

Jean-Fred (talk) 10:25, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

To me, this is a bit confusing. If I was doing a query, I would assume that Alice would have the same status as a single host on another podcast. Or are you suggesting that even those with just one host should also always have the qualifier like Bob? Ainali (talk) 11:44, 24 January 2024 (UTC)

Youtube seems to be becoming a podcast host

I have noticed for a number of podcast and podcast-like videos (and even audio) now seem to have youtube as their primary distribution channel, any ideas how we can make this integrate nicely with what we have been doing? Back ache (talk) 10:25, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

Shape Expressions (aka EntitySchema)

Hi all, after the announcement of Wikidata:WikiProject Podcast Episodes 2024 and listening to nerd, history, social science, and science podcasts for about two years, I realize that many of these have interesting citations to research papers, books, games, etc. From a Scholia (Q45340488)  perspective learning what podcasts are available for any main subject (P921) or for any work (article, book, etc), I find a useful new link reflecting why some podcast episode (Q61855877) is notable. I am discussing Scholia should have a podcast corner, reflecting such info, but also created four shape expressions: E418 for podcast (Q24634210), E419 for 'occupation (P106) podcaster (Q15077007)', E420 for podcast episode (Q61855877), and E421 for podcast series season (Q69154911). I have not added all properties listed for this project yet, but based on the 'episode 2024' tables for now. Have fun! Egon Willighagen (talk) 10:21, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

Property for subjects other than the main subject / talking points / mentions

Hi there, is there a property we can use for any subjects/talking points other than the main subject? I'm adding a podcast episode and the guests and host deviate from the main subject a lot. Mitsjol (talk) 10:44, 24 January 2024 (UTC)

+1 I like to learn about that too, see the next discussion point. -- Egon Willighagen (talk) 06:26, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Scholia aspects

Following up on the entity schema (see comment above of about 2 weeks ago), I have started a Scholia aspect: https://github.com/WDscholia/scholia/pull/2413 The page has some screenshots. Basically, I like to ask you: what would you like to see on a Scholia page for 1. a podcast, 2. a podcast season, 3. a podcast episode? One thing I would like to have, but the podcast data in Wikidata does not really use that, is information on books, journal articles, movies, games, etc that are being discussed. What do you think? -- Egon Willighagen (talk) 21:28, 27 January 2024 (UTC)