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Property talk:P358

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discography
link to discography in artist or band page
Descriptionlist of works by the subject, e. g. a discography, bibliography or filmography - thematic catalog (Q2560570)
Representsdiscography (Q273057), thematic catalog (Q2560570), recording catalog (Q16832380)
Data typeItem
Domain
According to this template: persons or groups
According to statements in the property:
person (Q215627), group of humans (Q16334295), fictional human (Q15632617), dramatico-musical work (Q58483083) and record label (Q18127)
When possible, data should only be stored as statements
Allowed valuesis a list of => albums - is a list of (P360) => album (Q482994) (note: this should be moved to the property statements)
ExampleKaty Perry (Q42493)Katy Perry discography (Q1415272)
Britney Spears (Q11975)Britney Spears discography (Q474659)
Madonna (Q1744)Madonna albums discography (Q498365)
Tracking: usageCategory:Pages using Wikidata property P358 (Q23909092)
Lists
Proposal discussionProposal discussion
Current uses5,673
Search for values
  Type “person (Q215627), group of humans (Q16334295), fictional human (Q15632617), dramatico-musical work (Q58483083), record label (Q18127): element must contain property “instance of (P31)” with classes “person (Q215627), group of humans (Q16334295), fictional human (Q15632617), dramatico-musical work (Q58483083), record label (Q18127)” or their subclasses (defined using subclass of (P279)). (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist.
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P358#type Q215627, Q16334295, Q15632617, Q58483083, Q18127, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)
  Value type “discography (Q273057): This property should use items as value that contain property “instance of (P31)”. On these, the value for instance of (P31) should be an item that uses subclass of (P279) with value discography (Q273057) (or a subclass thereof). (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist.
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P358#Value type Q273057, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)
  Single value: this property generally contains a single value. (Help)
Exceptions are possible as rare values may exist. Known exceptions: Art Pepper (Q468202)
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P358#Single value, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)
  Distinct values: this property likely contains a value that is different from all other items. (Help)
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P358#Unique value, hourly updated report, SPARQL (every item), SPARQL (by value), SPARQL (new)
  Scope is as main value (Q54828448): the property must be used by specified way only (Help)
List of this constraint violations: Database reports/Constraint violations/P358#scope, hourly updated report, SPARQL, SPARQL (new)

Inverse propertyEdit

The reverse can be artist or author. Infovarius (talk) 16:18, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Constraint conflictEdit

One of the constraints here is that discography (P358) is an inverse property of performer (P175). Thus, a discography must have a performer, which is a questionable attribution (nobody performs a discography, it's a discography of a performer's work). Further on, P175 has an item constraint that P107 (P107) has to be work (Q386724), and so any discography would have to be a creative work. And thus we finally say "This discography is a creative work of artist X", just as are any of the albums listed on it. In the proposal discussion linked above, Airon90 suggested a "Discography of" property to link discographies with the according artists, and nobody responded. I'm not sure whether we need this one or if there already is some other property that could be used here, but I don't think performer (P175) is the right one to use here. --YMS (talk) 19:19, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Mmmm a discography may not have a performer, but it is the work of an associated artist; since I'm not a fan of adding very specific properties like "discography of", I think the constraint above is appropriate. I rather doubt the requirement for performer (P175) to be used only on creative work items: for example, an artist could be a performer at a show or festival, that are events rather than creative works. -- LaddΩ chat ;) 14:26, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
Another way to solve this conflict would be to not have any statements about the performer on an discography item at all, so the only link between artist and discography is the "discography" property on the artist item. This is not ideal currently, as neither a Wikidata item page shows any information about other items linking to it, nor is there a proper way to query such links. Anyway we already have plenty of links that only work one-way. --YMS (talk) 11:33, 15 October 2013 (UTC)
That would be a good idea, if only the reverse-link request was already available. However until that time, if we were to get rid of "artist/performer", some other property would soon be proposed & used to play the same role... since people naturally want a link from a discography to the performing artist. I see no way out. - LaddΩ chat ;) 22:47, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

Target required claimEdit

Hi there! In my opinion it is wrong to use the value album (Q482994) for property is a list of (P360), because a discography is not only a list for albums of an interpret but for every kind of audio storage devices. For this reason I propose to use audio storage device (Q354004) as value insteed. --Bigbossfarin (talk) 11:48, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Not a bad idea, but you will need a bot to replace that statement in all existing items. - LaddΩ chat ;) 20:44, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Rather require "instance of" "discography" on targetEdit

I'm proposing to change the constraint on the target: "list of" album (Q482994)     may be fine, but instance of (P31) discography (Q273057)     is clearer for everyone; moreover, discography (Q273057)     is itself defined with: is a list of (P360) audio storage device (Q354004)     anyhow. It does not prevent also adding a statement is a list of (P360) on the artist-specific discography, so it should suit everyone. LaddΩ chat ;) 16:13, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Agree and changed appropriately. --Infovarius (talk) 08:35, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

Broaden scopeEdit

In addition to this property there is also filmography (P1283) and now there is a proposal to create another property for bibliographies. In the future, one can imagine equivalent properties being created for lists of works of painters and architects.

To me, this seems redundant. Items that are linked through these properties are basically just links to lists on Wikipedia so there's no real need to keep them separate.

I would therefore propose that filmography (P1283) be merged into this property and that its name be changed to something like "list of works". It could then be used to link any list of works by a person to that person.

Technically, this would be easy to implement. Only the name and perhaps some of the constraints need to be changed. filmography (P1283) is only used for a handful of items so it could be abolished rather quickly. Väsk (talk) 21:55, 6 August 2014 (UTC)

I like the idea, because some items are lists of several kinds of works by an artist. For instance the enwiki article in Bob Dylan discography (Q832646) lists both music, films and books. I wonder if any artist has more than one such list (for instance both bibliography and discography). If that is the case, qualifiers can probably be used. Dipsacus fullonum (talk) 10:54, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
I support broadening the scope. Cbrown1023 talk 14:30, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
  Support Bob Dylan is a convincing example. --Kolja21 (talk) 17:55, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
  Oppose Just because one list on enwiki mixes things, we don't need to do the same. --- Jura 13:09, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

I've now executed this change and have also tried to update the constraints to reflect this. It can be reverted easily if there is enough support for that.

Jura1: I think you've missed the point of this proposal. The items that are linked through this property are not much more than links to Wikipedia, so there's really no need to have different kinds of properties for them. These lists don't serve any real purpose for Wikidata beyond that, as we can generate such lists automatically. You can still get lists of discography items on Wikidata by using WDQ. Is there any particular reason why think we need separate properties for lists of works from different media? Väsk (talk) 13:28, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

  • Currently, you can't really query for filmographies of Bob Dylan. Besides, you seem to confuse bibliographies with lists of works. --- Jura 13:44, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
You can get a list of films starring Bob Dylan using Reasonator, but yes, it is a bit underdeveloped at the moment. For the purpose of this property, the word bibliography is used the way it is on Wikipedia (i.e. analogous with filmography) and linked items would be Wikipedia pages with lists of books. A possible "bibliography" property would be used the same way, so I don't see this as a reason why we need different properties for them. Väsk (talk) 14:12, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
Well, reasonator gets you items with films, but if you just want an existing filmography that would be a separate article you can't.
About bibliographies, do you agree that "list of works by subject" is not a suitable property? --- Jura 14:17, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
No, I see a value in having Wikidata items link together subjects with Wikipedia lists of works by those subjects, if the latter exists. You've voted for creating another such property, so I think we agree on that particular issue. What I still don't get is why we would need different properties to link to lists of works just because they use different media. Väsk (talk) 14:40, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
Imho it's not good changing the English title and description of this property on your own. You know that there is a Wikidata:Property proposal/Creative work for "bibliography". --Kolja21 (talk) 16:24, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
I also think so and reverted the changes, even though I support the proposal here. But don't create facts before the discussion is finished. And once it's finished and we decided to merge those properties, let's think twice whether it's a good idea to give this existing property a completely new purpose or delete it and create a new one. Changing the semanctics of something existing is rarely a good idea, in my opinion. --YMS (talk) 10:40, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
New property: list of works (P1455). --Kolja21 (talk) 03:24, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
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